Correct order of try and YC

[The Fat]

Saw this a couple of weeks ago and didn't think much of it until something similar happened again.

1st Game: Time off for injuries, subs, admonishments etc

2nd Game: No time off i.e. no injury time and clock keeps running for subs, AR reports, admonishments/cards etc

Red team attacking from about 30m out and 10m from side line and green 12 offside from ruck (about 20m from touch) so now playing advantage. Play moves forward and green 1 offside at ruck about 15m out and centre field. New advantage. Tackle and ruck about 1.5m from goal line and green 12 dives over ruck as ball is at the back but not out. Red 9 is just about to put hands on when green 12 dives over. Red 9 does manage to flick ball to prop who dives over.

Sequence of events from here.
1. Ref blows for try.
2. Ref blows for time off.
3. Calls green captain and green 12 out
4. Ref points out that he had played 3 advantages to red and that the 1st and last offences were both by green 12 with the last being cynical.
5. Ref gives green 12 a YC
6. Time on
7. Red kicker takes conversion

2nd game events were similar but not quite identical in that there were 3 offences with advantage but each one was by a different player. However last one was still close to the goal line.
Remembering that the 2nd game is a lower grade with no stoppage time, would you use the same sequence as in 1st game? The kicker has 90 seconds from when the try was scored to take the kick.
The ref did something different in this game that I thought was good but had people in the crowd a little confused.

I'll wait for some comments before saying what he did.

 

[leaguerefaus]

Saw this a couple of weeks ago and didn't think much of it until something similar happened again.

1st Game: Time off for injuries, subs, admonishments etc

2nd Game: No time off i.e. no injury time and clock keeps running for subs, AR reports, admonishments/cards etc

Red team attacking from about 30m out and 10m from side line and green 12 offside from ruck (about 20m from touch) so now playing advantage. Play moves forward and green 1 offside at ruck about 15m out and centre field. New advantage. Tackle and ruck about 1.5m from goal line and green 12 dives over ruck as ball is at the back but not out. Red 9 is just about to put hands on when green 12 dives over. Red 9 does manage to flick ball to prop who dives over.

Sequence of events from here.
1. Ref blows for try.
2. Ref blows for time off.
3. Calls green captain and green 12 out
4. Ref points out that he had played 3 advantages to red and that the 1st and last offences were both by green 12 with the last being cynical.
5. Ref gives green 12 a YC
6. Time on
7. Red kicker takes conversion

2nd game events were similar but not quite identical in that there were 3 offences with advantage but each one was by a different player. However last one was still close to the goal line.
Remembering that the 2nd game is a lower grade with no stoppage time, would you use the same sequence as in 1st game? The kicker has 90 seconds from when the try was scored to take the kick.
The ref did something different in this game that I thought was good but had people in the crowd a little confused.

I'll wait for some comments before saying what he did.

I'd do it the same way. Even though there's no stopping of the clock, once I signalled time-off I would stop the kicker's 90 seconds.

 

[Browner]

Whilst the YC is being issued the Red kicker has additional ' free time' to prepare his kick, so I suppose ref could continue with the conversion kick and then YC green 12.

However, unless Green12 is removed before the conversion attempt he could charge down the conversion , so its better he leaves before the kick?

 

[Simon Thomas]

My preference, and in my view tidiest management, is to call TIME OFF get the player off with the YC while minds are still focused in what had happened.
Then TIME ON and progress to the kick.
If a player had been injured you would have followed the same TIME OFF and TIME ON sequence

 

[TigerCraig]

I always blow time on/time off for everything - even though none of the games I do actually have time off (except for state championships)

I had almost this same thing on Sunday - Under 18's

Shoulder charge 3-5 metres out by Green. Black player knocked to ground but able to pop ball up to support who scored adjacent to the posts.

Awarded try, blew for time on, called Green captain and player out. While waiting for them to come over I showed the Black kicker where his line was and then while he was setting his tee and placing the ball I issued the card and made a note in my book. Then blew time on By that time the kicker was set and actually took his kick within close enough to 90 seconds of the try.

 

[Dickie E]

If no time off I'd award the try, pull the card and tell Green 12 to go and have a sit down.

If Green captain wanted to discuss he can do that as Red kicker is setting up.

The point is there doesn't need to be a big song & dance with the card unless it suits you to do so.

 

[talbazar]

If no time off I'd award the try, pull the card and tell Green 12 to go and have a sit down.

If Green captain wanted to discuss he can do that as Red kicker is setting up.

The point is there doesn't need to be a big song & dance with the card unless it suits you to do so.

I guess that would be the preferred way of doing things for 7's and 10's as you very rarely the big "song and dance" for a card in these forms of the game.
For 15's, it's all up to what you want to achieve and how much time you need... To go along with Craig above, most of the time in 15's the "song and dance" will fit within the 90 seconds anyway, but it's neater to stop time (IMHO)

Pierre.

 

[Blue Smartie]

Surely there is a distinction between (a) the referees' ability to call "time off" during a game and (b) the competition or age grade rules which mean that you do not play additional time over that which is allotted for the match.
Calling time off gives you the opportunity to create space (and time) to deal with an incident (foul play; injury etc) over the alternative, which is simply that your whistle means the ball is dead.
If you needed medical assistance to treat the try scorer first you would still allow the conversion attempt notwithstanding it might have been more than the prescribed time.

 

[Dickie E]

Surely there is a distinction between (a) the referees' ability to call "time off" during a game and (b) the competition or age grade rules which mean that you do not play additional time over that which is allotted for the match.

No. If there is a serious injury in the first minute and it takes the ambulance 79 minutes to get it sorted, then time and game.

 

[The Fat]

No. If there is a serious injury in the first minute and it takes the ambulance 79 minutes to get it sorted, then time and game.

I refereed a senior game earlier this season where there was no injury time etc. As per your comment, we had an injury 5 minutes into the 2nd half, ambulance called and by the time injury was sorted, we had 6 minutes left to play. Easy day at the office that one.

 

[OB..]

No. If there is a serious injury in the first minute and it takes the ambulance 79 minutes to get it sorted, then time and game.

I thought that was what he said. The referee can call time off, but in effect does not stop his watch. He has simply informed the teams that play will not restart until he has done whatever (YC, injury). Since time is nominally stopped, the 90 seconds for a conversion is not running until time nominally restarts. The "time off" denotes playing time lost.

 

[leaguerefaus]

I thought that was what he said. The referee can call time off, but in effect does not stop his watch. He has simply informed the teams that play will not restart until he has done whatever (YC, injury). Since time is nominally stopped, the 90 seconds for a conversion is not running until time nominally restarts. The "time off" denotes playing time lost.

That's how I took it OB!

 

[Simon Thomas]

I refereed a senior game earlier this season where there was no injury time etc. As per your comment, we had an injury 5 minutes into the 2nd half, ambulance called and by the time injury was sorted, we had 6 minutes left to play. Easy day at the office that one.

A result of your logistics in Australia of having sequential matches on one pitch.

In UK for 15 a side matches we usually have the same kick off time for multiple matches across multiple pitches at the rugby clubs so we can allow time off for injuries, admonishments, etc can be added on and so the full playing time of 80 minutes or U18 variants time can be completed fully.

 

[Browner]

A result of your logistics in Australia of having sequential matches on one pitch.

In UK for 15 a side matches we usually have the same kick off time for multiple matches across multiple pitches at the rugby clubs so we can allow time off for injuries, admonishments, etc can be added on and so the full playing time of 80 minutes or U18 variants time can be completed fully.

Our English club sometimes runs consecutive juniors matches on same pitches ( due to lack of alternatives ) overruns are mostly just absorbed & I can't remember an injury causing a major overrun issue, ever.