Defending team kicks ball beyond their own dead ball line

[Locke]

I’m a newer ref and a simple situation in a game over the weekend has me stumped, but I suspect the answer is obvious and I am simply overlooking it.

Lower level men’s game. Red is in possession in blue territory, around the 22. Red player in possession kicks and chases, blue defender turns and chases as well. Blue player gets to the ball first, around the 5 meter line, and kicks the ball straight oout the back of in-goal, across his own dead ball line.

I took a second to decide what the restart should be, couldn’t come up with a confident decision internally, and announced the restart would be a goal line drop out, hoping player uncertainty around the new law trial would prevent any complaints about the call.

Now, despite an honest attempt to find what I expected to be a clear and simple answer in the good book, I can’t seem to find any mention of the situation. Law 21.11 clearly covers when a team kicks over their opponent’s dead ball line but I have found nothing referencing a team kicking over their own dead ball line. The table in law 19.1 says that if “the ball is taken into in-goal by the defending team and made dead,” play restarts with a 5-meter scrum to the attacking team. Based on this principle, I assume this is the correct call for my situation instead of the goal line drop out I awarded, but I don’t feel the law I quoted actually covers the situation I encountered because I don’t think kicking falls under the law’s normal use of a player “taking” the ball somewhere.

Now that I have written too many words, can someone kindly direct me to the law that I am not finding that covers this simple situation?

 

[crossref]

it is indeed a 5m attacking scrum, and 19.1 is the Law.

It would be much clearer if they would cover it in Law 21 In Goal -- but they don't :-(

GLD is for only three things
- held up
- attackers knock on in goal
- attackers KICK into in goal, and defenders make dead

 

[Locke]

I appreciate the response and clarification. I’ll be ready for next time!

 

[didds]

out of interest Locke did any players query your GLD call? Nicely at least In the bar afterwards?



( I suspect not, aside form the clearly very bright and clued up props who all looked at each and shrugged.... ;-) )

 

[Locke]

No, I didn’t hear a word about it

 

[Zebra1922]

No, I didn’t hear a word about it

Not surprising, most players don’t know the laws, they definitely don’t know the new laws. I’d be surprised if any of them were 100% certain.

 

[crossref]

Not surprising, most players don’t know the laws, they definitely don’t know the new laws. I’d be surprised if any of them were 100% certain.

also for most players, they don't really have any interest after a game in approaching the ref to point out a minor law error....

 

[Arabcheif]

In games I've played, I've only ever experienced the ref coming back once. That was this past weekend funnily enough. I don't think anyone asked him any questions about the match/Law. I've stayed after refereeing twice but just kept myself to myself. TBH if they asked me a question about a specific call, chances are I'd not remember it... unless it was followed by a flash point or I'd issued a card. So I'd probably just say, look I don't remember the incident, but I called what I saw. If it turns out I'd had a brain fart then I'd say I'd had a brain fart.

 

[crossref]

In games I've played, I've only ever experienced the ref coming back once. That was this past weekend funnily enough. I .

I am very surprised at that, my belief in London is that ref almost always appears in the bar after (although perhaps not when it's a twenty minute walk to a pub)

 

[didds]

I am very surprised at that, my belief in London is that ref almost always appears in the bar after (although perhaps not when it's a twenty minute walk to a pub)

ditto in deepest darkest wiltshire/dorset/somerset/glos/hants

 

[Flish]

I always go for a drink in the bar post match, if I can’t I make sure I let the captains know pre match and make my apologies. Don’t get me wrong, sometimes I buy my own drink and stand on my own, but I’m there and accessible if anyone wants to chat or talk through anything.

Like all things some clubs are better at engaging with refs post match, get a drink in, approach to chat, sometimes involved in the MotM / DotD selection, which is great, but I just make sure I’m accessible if they want - this is their game and time far more than mine.

 

[Stu10]

I sometimes wonder why people choose to referee. I do it partly to enable a match for our age group, but nothing stopping one of the other coaches... I put my hand up to ref every week because I enjoy it, and I'm more than happy to discuss the laws with anyone after the match (in fact I also engage both teams at half time to ask if they have any questions).

I don't understand referees that appear to be angry the whole game and clearly not enjoying it.

 

[SimonSmith]

I am very surprised at that, my belief in London is that ref almost always appears in the bar after (although perhaps not when it's a twenty minute walk to a pub)

When in England, the only time I haven't gone to the bar is when, coming off after the whistle, a "fan" muttered in my ear that "you''d better not becoming in the bar afterwards referee" in a way that suggested my safety was at risk.

Change. Car. Phone to Ref Soc. Never went back there again.

 

[chbg]

When in England, the only time I haven't gone to the bar is when, coming off after the whistle, a "fan" muttered in my ear that "you''d better not becoming in the bar afterwards referee" in a way that suggested my safety was at risk.

Change. Car. Phone to Ref Soc. Never went back there again.

Perhaps just me, but now (after a number of years' refereeing) that would just make me more determined to go in. Perhaps not in my best No 1s!

 

[Phil E]

Perhaps just me, but now (after a number of years' refereeing) that would just make me more determined to go in. Perhaps not in my best No 1s!

Me too...must be a military thing

 

[Harry]

The only argument I ever had with a referee was in the bar.
He had lost count it was definitely my round.

 

[OB..]

We used to have a "free beer for the ref" policy until one ref drank 12. He admitted after three that his wife was coming to pick him up later (literally - she needed help to get him into the car). Apparently she was used to this.

A couple of clubs extended this courtesy to an assessor, but I only ever had the one.