Dylan "54 weeks" Hartley

[Phil E]

87% of statistics are wrong....that's a fact!

 

[4eyesbetter]

58.4% of all statistics are made up on the spot.

 

[menace]

?....would point intelegent referees in the right direction.

Oh the irony.....

But from Hartly thuggery to the philosophy of statistics within 20 posts....how did that quantum leap occur? A result of chaos theory because a butterfly farted in a Brazillian rainforest?

 

[Phil E]

What sort of butterfly?

 

[menace]

Fluted swallowtail of course!

 

[Phil E]

Fluted swallowtail of course!

African Fluted Swallowtail or European Fluted Swallowtail?

 

[Rushforth]

African Fluted Swallowtail or European Fluted Swallowtail?

South American. Obviously.

 

[Browner]

Non-statisticians (particularly politicians) make all sorts of statistically invalid claims.

indeed, sometimes with no more than the factual accuracy of ? say .......... that statement.


All I can imagine was the Citing officer had got his mate to zip to the casino & wager that Jamie George would play in the RWC !

More interesting is how many other nations have blindeye ignored their players pre tournament indiscretions.

 

[crossref]

every indiscretion is different. some are quite correctly ignored. others quite correctly have conseqences.

 

[Ian_Cook]

But from Hartly thuggery to the philosophy of statistics within 20 posts....how did that quantum leap occur? A result of chaos theory because a butterfly farted in a Brazillian rainforest?

The thread diverted into statistics from post #4, when someone tried to use statistics at RWCs to defend Hartley's poor behaviour and potential participation in RWC.

Go Figure!!

 

[Ian_Cook]

More interesting is how many other nations have blindeye ignored their players pre tournament indiscretions.

How many other nations have such a player to "blind-eye ignore", one with anything approaching 54 weeks of suspensions in eight years for a wide variety of "indiscretions" such as biting, eye-gouging, elbowing in the face, head-butting, punching and calling the referee a "f***ing cheat"

How do you reconcile your well-advertised hard-nosed attitude to retaliation with your excusing of this player's retaliatory "indiscretions"?

 

[Pegleg]

Oh the irony.....

But from Hartly thuggery to the philosophy of statistics within 20 posts....how did that quantum leap occur? A result of chaos theory because a butterfly farted in a Brazillian rainforest?

I'm no typist especially on a Phone keyboard. I do appologize for that. The point remains true.

 

[Lee Lifeson-Peart]

If memory serves, Canada got screwed because of a mini brawl in which Gareth Rees got RCed.

the risk Hartley represents isn't just the RC - it's going down to 14 men for 10 minutes which is usually accompanied by points as well.

Indeedy. In 1995 the 2 Canadian RCs (Rees and Snow) and the SA one (Dalton) were on the back of one brawl/match so apart from that aberration both side's records are reasonably good.

Dalton was unlucky to get sent off although the SA winger (Hendricks? Roussouw?) should have walked for a few sly kicks into a Canadian head mid brawl - TMOs would've seen him walk although that is true of most mentioned above and some others - eg Wayne Shelford v Wales in 1987 - much as I abhor Rugby violence I always chuckle when recalling Huw Richards (ironically the 1st RWC RC) had to be revived only to be sent off! :biggrin:

Hartley can't seem to grasp the impact his antics have on his team both during the match and thereafter (in terms of suspension). I think he's a liability and would rather go with Youngs, Webber and Walker (off the wall maybe) although now I've written it down I can see that that would leave England depleted.

 

[Ian_Cook]

Hartley can't seem to grasp the impact his antics have on his team both during the match and thereafter (in terms of suspension). I think he's a liability and would rather go with Youngs, Webber and Walker (off the wall maybe) although now I've written it down I can see that that would leave England depleted.

He also can't seem to grasp that the modern elite game is covered from, literally, a dozen camera angles, that there are four pairs of eyes watching, and more pairs of eye reviewing afterwards.

Getting away with what he does is not a realistic expectation.

 

[L'irlandais]

South American. Obviously.

Sorry, I don't understand your answer, but perhaps I didn't catch the question.

Estimating the Airspeed Velocity of an Unladen Swallow

...lead me to estimate that the average cruising airspeed velocity of an unladen European Swallow is roughly 11 meters per second, or 24 miles an hour.

If the average coconut weighs 680 grams, where the F does that leave us?
Is it a simple question of weight ratios?

 

[Rushforth]

Sorry, I don't understand your answer, but perhaps I didn't catch the question.

Perhaps you got confused by the difference between swallows (birds) and swallowtails (flutterbys).

Brazilian Swallowtails go "whoosh".

 

[Browner]

eg Wayne Shelford v Wales in 1987 - much as I abhor Rugby violence I always chuckle when recalling Huw Richards (ironically the 1st RWC RC) had to be revived only to be sent off! :biggrin:

Surely based on severity, the PK should have gone against NZ, WS was the best connection by a long chalk.

Granted DH is a often a prat in a Saints shirt, and any 'dangerous' retaliation deserves both PK & sanctioning at the level befitting his offence, but he has a better record than say Warburton when it comes to 'vacating' the pitch when representing his nation !

on 25/2/15 Mick Cleary wrote

In the 32 matches the England hooker has played in the Six Nations Championship, dating back six years to 2009, Hartley has never once been sent to the sin bin. Not once, not for technical issues, or daft penalties

i haven't checked his data, but if correct this suggests that some of the claims that he might let his nation down whilst in a England shirt are {dare i say it} predictably 'prejudiced/jaundiced'.

 

[Ian_Cook]

Surely based on severity, the PK should have gone against NZ, WS was the best connection by a long chalk.

Granted DH is a often a prat in a Saints shirt, and any 'dangerous' retaliation deserves both PK & sanctioning at the level befitting his offence, but he has a better record than say Warburton when it comes to 'vacating' the pitch when representing his nation !

Ah, so now you are saying that you don't penalise the retaliator if the instigator got the better punch in? Changing your tune now?

on 25/2/15 Mick Cleary wrote i haven't checked his data, but if correct this suggests that some of the claims that he might let his nation down whilst in a England shirt are {dare i say it} predictably 'prejudiced/jaundiced'.

• In the 32 matches the England hooker has played in the Six Nations Championship, dating back six years to 2009, Hartley has never once been sent to the sin bin. Not once, not for technical issues, or daft penalties

Why would such a statistic mean anything? Its another example of cherry picking or filtering the sample to make the statistic mean something that you want it to mean. His participation in Six Nations has been for 35 of his 66 matches (just over half). If we look at the other half (31 matches) he's been YC three times;

18-09-2011 v Georgia (RWC) - for repeat infringements on defence
23-06-2012 v South Africa - for repeat infringements on defence
15-11-2014 v South Africa - for stamping on Duane Vermuelen in a maul

A card every 10 matches. Now that doesn't look so flash does it?

Sorry, but you and Mick Cleary are trying to find a correlation where there is none. The fact that Hartley hasn't been carded in the Six Nations is utterly irrelevant. Hartley is exactly what he appears to be, an unremitting thug with a disgraceful rap sheet. He's been given chance after chance, and SL is well shot of him. There are plenty of England hookers who bring as much to the table as he does but are not such a liability. Rob Youngs is a damned good hooker; I'd have him or Jamie George or Rob Webber in my team before I'd ever select Hartley.

 

[Browner]

FFS, will someone get this idiot off my case!, he's aware that I stopped replying to him directly many months ago, his MOD status won't let me block him, sadly.

 

[Ian_Cook]

FFS, will someone get this idiot off my case!, he's aware that I stopped replying to him directly many months ago, his MOD status won't let me block him, sadly.

You have the choice not to read my posts, and the choice not to reply to them, however, I WILL NOT let your bullshit go unchallenged, and I WILL REPLY to your posts if I so choose, so that others can see my opinion of your rubbish.

You also do not have the right to dictate to me or anyone else (mod or no mod) who will and will not post replies to your posts. Even if I were not a mod, I would still reply to your posts and call you on the bullshit when you post it.

FYI, it is not possible to "block" anyone on this forum, mod or otherwise. Its not like twitter. When you "ignore" a user, you still see that a post has been made by that user ....

...its just that the content of the post is not visible, although it can be revealed by clicking "view post"