gamesmanship in the chock tackle

breako


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Reds play Blue.
Red ball carrier is "choked tackled". Red players join in drive him forward. Ref shouts "Maul".
Maul goes down legally and ball is almost playable. A blue player who is on the deck would just mode his hand which is the only thing on the ball. Blue player doesn't want to move his hand as he wants the ball deemed unplayable and get the turnover.

Scrum half looks at the ball and really wants that ball.

Should the ref:
1. Blow the whistle as ball is not deemed fully playable and give the turnover
2. Tell the Blue player to move his hand and let the ball be played.
3. Something else.

Thanks
 
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CrouchTPEngage


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Hi breako ! Assuming your typo was "choke-tackled". The blue player ( on hearing the Maul call ) doesnt have to release the ball or the ball-carrier when it goes to ground.
So the answer is (1)
 

breako


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But then there will be a mess. The Scrum Half will be trying to rip the ball up and there's a Blue hand on it.
 

Pinky


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But then there will be a mess. The Scrum Half will be trying to rip the ball up and there's a Blue hand on it.

And that's OK, as long as he is not doing something else to the blue player, like stamping on his hand.
 

Decorily

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But then there will be a mess. The Scrum Half will be trying to rip the ball up and there's a Blue hand on it.
All the more reason to blow it early before the mess develops.
 

breako


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And that's OK, as long as he is not doing something else to the blue player, like stamping on his hand.
The blue player will try to stop the Red SH doing this in which case he is playing the ball on the ground.
 

Decorily

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If the Blue player was part of the maul that collapsed he doesn't have to release/ remove his hand from the ball.
If the ball is not available immediately then turn over scrum.
 

Camquin

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However, once Blue is off their feet, they cannot then move to block the ball that was previously available.
 

Guyseep


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The blue player will try to stop the Red SH doing this in which case he is playing the ball on the ground.

nope. Assuming the blue player had his hand on the ball before the maul collapsed, he does not have to release it. It is a collapsed, unplayable maul. He is not playing the ball on the ground.
 

breako


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Well if the SH is trying to pick it up and then the Blue player starts applying more force, trying to get a tighter grip etc you could say leave it blue (this is what I meant by gamesmanship) or you could also blow it immediately and award turnover since the ball wasn't made available immediately
 

Marc Wakeham


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Well if the SH is trying to pick it up and then the Blue player starts applying more force, trying to get a tighter grip etc you could say leave it blue (this is what I meant by gamesmanship) or you could also blow it immediately and award turnover since the ball wasn't made available immediately


Breako: The answer has been given and it is correct.

You cannot tell the blue player to leave it. The law does not support you. Infact it is good play NOT to "leave it"!


Following a collapsed maul there is no requirement for you to make the ball available. If the ball is not "IMMEDIATELY" available then it is turnover ball(Standard TO exceptions apply!). END OF!!
 

breako


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Sorry for the pedantry...
But, law 16.16.b says the Mauls ends when the ball is on ground.
So, ball is on the ground - all you need is for the blue players to remove his outstretched hands away from the ball as the maul has technically ended, then the Red SH can pass it away cleanly.
 

Marc Wakeham


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The maul ends YES but ithe blue player need now release it and allow caccess to red. The maul end unsuccessfully.


You've been told the answer. I will now leave the thread to your pedantary desires.
 
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