IRB approves trial for Rugby Goggles

[Browner]

If you believe basketball, or netball for that matter, are non-contact sports then you are living in cloud cuckoo land. I have not played basketball, but I used to play indoor netball in a mixed league (played in a totally enclosed indoor cricket arena) and I can honestly say I have never come off a sports court or field feeling so battered and bruised as regularly as I have after playing indoor netball. The girls are particularly brutal, with a surreptitious/accidental forearm or elbow in the face being not that uncommon.

Of course ........ collisions in your netball match [or basketball] will equal those that happen in rugby .... silly us thinking otherwise

 

[L'irlandais]

Browner,
Mulhouse has a Hallball team of renown. Our rugby first XV will never be renowned, as sad as that may be.
When I go to watch a handball match, I see a contact sport requiring courage. When I Watch our 1st XV it's not quite so inspiring.


Would you mind telling us what position you played? I never shirked a tackle at left-wing, (never mate, broken wrists for my entire 'O" levels 'n all) yet I don't think I'd want to play Handball, no thanks!

To be honest, I reckon I'd see you, Beretta 'n all ; unarmed, my friend. On the grounds that, if you need some hardware, you can't be all that tough!

 

[ChrisR]

View attachment 2778

My guess is the user gets to insert his own lenses in the obvious places. Assume lens material conforms to some code?

I think I'd recommend user to also wear a scrum cap so the'd be less likely to get dislodged.

 

[Jarrod Burton]

Trust me, netball is a sport for brave players, especially at the top levels. I've umpired matches where there have been broken legs and wrists; seen massive, legal contact between players where I've had to stop the match and order a girl off the court with suspected concussion and a lump on the head the size of a ping pong ball only 30 seconds after the contact; and bloodied noses and cuts on faces from head to head contact, yet we allow goggles and glasses in lower grades. There is just as much contact in netball and basketball, we just don't go on with it in rucks and mauls etc.

Browner, I've found many girls in netball willing to put their bodies on the line more than some of the guys I've reffed in rugby - and netball is played on concrete/solid floors.

If the visor/goggles are shatter proof and the frame soft, then go for it. I, like marauder, would like to see a scrum cap to hold them in place, or better still, be built into a scrum cap to minimise the chance of them being dislodged down and becoming a choking hazard.

 

[Ian_Cook]

Trust me, netball is a sport for brave players, especially at the top levels. I've umpired matches where there have been broken legs and wrists; seen massive, legal contact between players where I've had to stop the match and order a girl off the court with suspected concussion and a lump on the head the size of a ping pong ball only 30 seconds after the contact; and bloodied noses and cuts on faces from head to head contact, yet we allow goggles and glasses in lower grades. There is just as much contact in netball and basketball, we just don't go on with it in rucks and mauls etc.

That certainly matches my personal experience, especially in the Indoor version where there is is no "out". The ball can be passed and played off the side, end and top nets. The action is fast and continuous.

In rugby, you are prepared for the hit because its part of the game; in netball the hit may not be as severe but they can come unexpectedly and from any direction.

NOTE: Netballers could teach rugby players a thing or two about putting an unmarked player into a gap!!!

 

[menace]

View attachment 2778

My guess is the user gets to insert his own lenses in the obvious places. Assume lens material conforms to some code?

I think I'd recommend user to also wear a scrum cap so the'd be less likely to get dislodged.

Admittedly I've not seen them 'in the flesh' but they still look quite rigid, and if they are, I'm sorry but I just can't see how these can be safe for the wearer or their opposition? Unless they're as soft as ski goggles, or slip off if the contact is super tough/rough (therefore i think te ability for them to dislodge can help reduce their potential danger) then I can't see how it won't eventually cause some injury.

 

[RobLev]

If you believe basketball, or netball for that matter, are non-contact sports then you are living in cloud cuckoo land. I have not played basketball, but I used to play indoor netball in a mixed league (played in a totally enclosed indoor cricket arena) and I can honestly say I have never come off a sports court or field feeling so battered and bruised as regularly as I have after playing indoor netball. The girls are particularly brutal, with a surreptitious/accidental forearm or elbow in the face being not that uncommon.

Since the only broken bone I've had was inflicted in a netball match between my fencing club and a Croydon Young Mothers team, I'm fully aware that the "theoretically" I put in my original post is justified. Nevertheless, if I dive headfirst (the head being where the goggles are located) at the ball carrier playing rugby nobody bats an eyelid - in basketball and netball the whistle should blow.

Again, if you end up with a pile of 7 bodies from each team in netball, someone is committing an offence (offside at minimum) - but in rugby we call it the later stages of a ruck.

In rugby, your head/face routinely and legally comes into contact with an opponent's body many times a match; that is not the case in basketball or netball.

 

[ChrisR]

The purpose of the trial is discovery. I'm wondering what position the referee should take if an opponent objected to them.

 

[Ian_Cook]

Since the only broken bone I've had was inflicted in a netball match between my fencing club and a Croydon Young Mothers team, I'm fully aware that the "theoretically" I put in my original post is justified. Nevertheless, if I dive headfirst (the head being where the goggles are located) at the ball carrier playing rugby nobody bats an eyelid - in basketball and netball the whistle should blow.

Again, if you end up with a pile of 7 bodies from each team in netball, someone is committing an offence (offside at minimum) - but in rugby we call it the later stages of a ruck.

In rugby, your head/face routinely and legally comes into contact with an opponent's body many times a match; that is not the case in basketball or netball.

All the same, I think Browner's post was somewhat over the top in that he was awfulizing. If these goggles are as soft as I have been told, I don't see how they could cause injury any more than a scrum cap could.

The purpose of the trial is discovery. I'm wondering what position the referee should take if an opponent objected to them.

The same attitude that he should take if someone objected to an opponent's scrum cap; check for the iRB approved logo. If it's present, objection overruled!

 

[Browner]

Browner,

Would you mind telling us what position you played?
To be honest, I reckon I'd see you, Beretta 'n all ; unarmed, my friend. On the grounds that, if you need some hardware, you can't be all that tough!

Mostly 8 [6... or even 7 in my youth 'or' on really soft pitches !]. We'll never know.... xx, but if it helps you, I concede.

 

[SimonSmith]

The purpose of the trial is discovery. I'm wondering what position the referee should take if an opponent objected to them.

Guidance is that (assuming they are legal) a player who objects to playing against an opponent wearing them may recuse himself from the match

 

[Ciaran Trainor]

So at this moment in time they are not legal in england correct?

On the netball front it is a tough sport.
I few years ago I participated in a works sports day for my then company RO Defence part of the BAE Systems group at loughborough university.
one of the sports was mixed Netball and we had proper referees/Umpires.
Played against a welsh team from Glascoed in the final and we beat them despite them having 2 county players.
We worked out that we could pass the ball rugby style up and down the court only taking the one step.
Despite protests the Umpires ruled what we were doing was legal theough we did get pulled up a bit for contact.
Happy days and still undefeated champions as that was the last year we did it........dmn you overhead cutbacks!!!

 

[Blackberry]

I'm OK with goggles, but bearing in mind the swathe of weather cancellations, could the IRB trial snorkels as well?

 

[Jenko]

So at this moment in time they are not legal in england correct?

On the netball front it is a tough sport.
I few years ago I participated in a works sports day for my then company RO Defence part of the BAE Systems group at loughborough university.
one of the sports was mixed Netball and we had proper referees/Umpires.
Played against a welsh team from Glascoed in the final and we beat them despite them having 2 county players.
We worked out that we could pass the ball rugby style up and down the court only taking the one step.
Despite protests the Umpires ruled what we were doing was legal theough we did get pulled up a bit for contact.
Happy days and still undefeated champions as that was the last year we did it........dmn you overhead cutbacks!!!

latest from RFU

Background
As you may be aware, the RFU and Constituent Bodies have received a number of complaints over the last season relating to the prohibition on sports goggles in all contact rugby at all ages. Discussions and considerable efforts have therefore been taking place internally for some time and the RFU has been liaising closely with the Association of British Dispensing Opticians to develop a practical solution to provide a wider degree of flexibility to enable great social inclusion in Rugby Union.
The RFU has therefore decided to introduce in England a trial that would enable the wearing of certain sport goggles (dispensed under professional supervision) by players playing contact rugby at the Under 13 age grade and below. This trial is a variation of the RFU’s current regulations which prohibits all types of goggles to be worn in contact rugby.
Whilst for the most part the trial will not take full hold until next season, the RFU recognises that some players may be in a position to adhere to the conditions of the trial in this current season. If this is the case, the RFU sees no reason why such players should be prevented from participating in the trial this season, provided all of the trial conditions are satisfied.
To this end, the trial will commence with immediate effect and will last until the end of the 2014-15 Season, whereupon the position will be reviewed further.
Conditions of the trial
The trial will permit players playing contact rugby at the Under 13 age grade and below to wear specially designed and manufactured sports goggles subject to the following conditions (all of which must be met):
(a) The sports goggles must be dispensed by a registered dispensing optician who is a member of the Association of British Dispensing Opticians* (“ABDO”); and
(b) The player must have written confirmation from the ABDO dispensing optician that the sports goggles:
i. Are required to correct the vision of the player or are required to protect the player’s eyes due to a medical condition, to enable the playing of Rugby Union; and
ii. Do not substantially restrict any normal field of vision and are suitable for use in evasion contact sports; and
iii. Do not constitute a physical danger to the player or other players; and
(c) The match referee is entitled to object to the player wearing the sports goggles if the referee reasonably believes that they are unsafe; and
(d) Clubs must notify the RFU Legal Officer of all players participating in the trial by emailing AlysLewis@rfu.com; and
(e) Clubs must report any injuries caused as a result of the sports goggles to the RFU Community Medical Team by emailing sportsinjuriesadmin@therfu.com and the player’s parents must report the injury to the ABDO dispensing optician who prescribed the goggles.
*If an optician is registered with the Association of British Dispensing Opticians, the optician will be listed on the General Optical Council’s list of registered members which is available at http://www.optical.org/. Please check the list by inserting the name of the individual optician or opticians practice.
Onward communication
In light of the number of upcoming festivals (including CB festivals), we wanted to inform Constituent Bodies, the ERSFU and the Referee’s Union as soon as a decision was made and in advance of the rest of the Game so that you have the opportunity to raise any queries directly with us if you so choose.
In due course, we will be notifying clubs of the implementation of the trial but should you wish to inform your clubs directly in the meantime, the RFU would have no objections to that.
Queries
Should you have any queries or require further clarification and guidance in relation to the proposed trial, please contact Alys Lewis .

 

[Browner]

A complex/data collection system is a great dissuader for reportees ...... ah ha ...rumbled!

Match inspection
little Jonnie wearing his goggles at the kit inspection.
parent stood alongside with ABDO letter (yeah right!).
Goggles arent broken, so i deem safe.
I collect the ABDO letter, which is returned to the parent at the end of the match ONLY if there are no injury's caused by Goggs

Works for me.

Ps....But hold on a cotton-pickin minute !!!!!!, that letter doesnt have a description/photo of the actual googles issued, so how do I know that the ones Jonnie is wearing are bonafide goggs....... ????? Sorry parent, I'm vulnerable here, Jonnie don't play. ????

 

[crossref]

latest from RFU

I actually received that email, as well
epper:

 

[crossref]

A complex/data collection system is a great dissuader for reportees ...... ah ha ...rumbled!

Match inspection
little Jonnie wearing his goggles at the kit inspection.
parent stood alongside with ABDO letter (yeah right!).
Goggles arent broken, so i deem safe.
I collect the ABDO letter, which is returned to the parent at the end of the match ONLY if there are no injury's caused by Goggs

Works for me.

Ps....But hold on a cotton-pickin minute !!!!!!, that letter doesnt have a description/photo of the actual googles issued, so how do I know that the ones Jonnie is wearing are bonafide goggs....... ????? Sorry parent, I'm vulnerable here, Jonnie don't play. ????

how likely is it that a parent would go to the trouble of getting a legal pair of goggles ... and then replace them with an illegal pair?

 

[didds]

Ok so ....... I buy goggles & now my son can now play whereas before he couldn't epper: I register to provide feedback [all good so far] , But say these goggles cause injuries to other players :shrug: & I know that if I provide this feedback to the IRB then my son might be stopped from playing ........... Q? will I provide the feedback? Will I log the injuries or track their long term effects....Will the referee report back such findings to the RFU---> IRB? if the answer to either of these is no, then what?............................. Or ............. should this be an 'already known & pre-determined outcome' trial?

IIRC its not for you as a parent to tell the RFU.

The parents role is to report it to your optician - the club informs the RFU.

however... your points otherwise are equally valid!

didds

 

[didds]

and the likelihood is as a society ref you are probably unlikely to ref a game with a goggled player.

its more likely to be a coach of his/the oppo team.

didds

 

[Browner]

IIRC its not for you as a parent to tell the RFU.

The parents role is to report it to your optician - the club informs the RFU.

however... your points otherwise are equally valid!

didds

Didds, tut tut.
You know that my earlier posting was referring to the IRB trial, and therefore shouldnt be referenced to this latest RFU trial posting.

I'm not overly concerned by the latest Goggs trial....... But I do see a trend in rugby administration which is this...
A plethora of regulations, varied by age/competition etc with an increasing burden on referees to be the library of rule checking / playing compliance....

Its a Liability avoidance drafting strategy, and if others can't see so, then all fool them.

As for GOGGS?, when he turns up then he'll play, provided he isn't wearing long underwear or blades that don't meet regs either !!!!