No Fun For anyone

[Ciaran Trainor]

Not sure how I would have felt refereeing this.
I know the home team are pushing for promotion and points difference may be crucial.
Level 5 in England very sad.

 

[crossref]

I think leagues should have a maximum PD (that can count for the league) say 60.
then it doesn't all come down to how much did you put past poor Kirby Lonsdale

 

[didds]

agree with CR. ive called for something similar in the past. Not elast becasue aside form the pointlessness of such daft scorelines you get scenarios whereby

* team A has a swathe of illnesses, a wedding etc etc and ends up fielding a seriously understanegth side to avoid a fine. most weeks they play tightly contested games - and now one week team B gets a hugely disproprortionate points difference which MIGHT influence their final league stahnding. (accepting even 60 points is a large PD but...)
* in the case of walkovers there is an obvious points award. Teams that regularly get trounced crying off (fine aside0 may end up only "giving" team B 25 points (or whatever). this way everybody ends the ssame whether playing a weakened team or a cry off.

 

[crossref]

in our local age group leagues the process was
- when the PD reached 40 (or poss 45, I am not sure) the ref blows whistle
- the scoreline at that moment is the result, for the league purposes. That's what is fed to the league organisers.
- the teams are asked if they would like to continue the match as a friendly.
- they invariably say yes
- the winning team invariably bring on all remaining subs to give them game time and (normally, but sadly not always) take off a couple of their best players
- the losing team gain confidence and score a consolation try or two and end the day happier

It works well.

 

[chbg]

in our local age group leagues the process was
- when the PD reached 40 (or poss 45, I am not sure) the ref blows whistle
- the scoreline at that moment is the result, for the league purposes. That's what is fed to the league organisers.
- the teams are asked if they would like to continue the match as a friendly.
- they invariably say yes
- the winning team invariably bring on all remaining subs to give them game time and (normally, but sadly not always) take off a couple of their best players
- the losing team gain confidence and score a consolation try or two and end the day happier

It works well.

All RFU Age Grade rugby should be played to the 50 point differential (U14 up, U13 6-try difference): Regulation 15.11.3

 

[crossref]

All RFU Age Grade rugby should be played to the 50 point differential (U14 up, U13 6-try difference): Regulation 15.11.3

I am probably out of date. Bit local leagues can presumably specify a lower number

 

[Jz558]

How gutted would you be to have a 190-0 win under your belt and still not have the highest 'points for' total in your league? Full credit to Kirkby Lonsdale for fulfilling their fixtures though.

 

[didds]

How gutted would you be to have a 190-0 win under your belt and still not have the highest 'points for' total in your league? Full credit to Kirkby Lonsdale for fulfilling their fixtures though.

and equally how gutting it would be to be another team level pegging with that team and missing out on promotion/getting relegated because one week an oppo had two weddings and a flu epidemic and fielded the only standing 18 left in the club including a 17 year winger from the Colts B team, a 59 year old that hasnt played for 17 years, and a pair of centres that are visully impaired?

 

[Lee Lifeson-Peart]

I saw this and agree it's not good.

Another 5 miles and it could have been in Yorkshire.

Joking aside I'm not sure what's going on at KL other than to say hats off to the players and staff for fulfilling the fixture. I recall Manchester getting spanked every week at L2 or L3 or L4 and for a number of years thereafter - after, I think their sugar daddy took his wallet elsewhere. Manchester have managed to reach an equilibrium and now seem settled in, ironically, the same league as KL and Blackburn.

I recall the delight when Manchester had managed to only lose 17-5 one week but then the typo was corrected to 71-5. They lost 80 odd games on the bounce over 3 years. One season I think they conceded over 2,500 pts and scored about 100 over a 30 game season.

That was occurring at the same time as Hartpury were spanking people going in the opposite direction. That was equally shit but at least the pain was spread about.

 

[Rich_NL]

Apparently they were relegated, a sponsor pulled out, and 30 players left because they couldn't get paid. So they're struggling on and trying to get a more sustainable model that doesn't rely on one big sponsor.

Seems like an artifact of being on the semi-pro boundary.

 

[didds]

Rich_NL - that certainly explains a lot. A bit like Newbury about a decade ago or so. Was in L2, now in L6.

 

[crossref]

so many rugby clubs - at all levels - depend on one single benefactor. It's worrying.

 

[DocP]

The problem is now, and we have suffered from this at my club, a lot of players expect free stash when they come to a club. That is a senior and junior levels. If it isn't on the table they jump to another club that does offer it.
This then puts pressure on a club to get a sponsor to purchase stash etc. It is a horrible trend that came in, for us, about 15 years ago.

 

[Stu10]

It's a tough season for KL, played 19 and lost 19. For Blackburn, despite this big win, they are still 100 "points for" behind Lymm.

On a positive (clutching at straws?), KL will be relegated and hopefully will have a more enjoyable season next year. I raise this point because I was talking to our 3rd team captain this week, who told me they have only won 2 games all season and would desperately like to drop a league, but they are second from bottom and will therefore not go down. He then mentioned considering to forfeit from the league before the season ends to get automatically demoted as punishment - there must be a better way to handle this!!!

 

[didds]

Ive long said that inclusion of "social" teams into leagues

pro: made ficxtures secretaries lives a lot easier
con: wasnt always appropriate for each team/squad.
clubs basically had no choice but to join leagues if everybody else was, as it meant/means 3 weeks out of four there are no teams to play a
"friendly" against.

 

[crossref]

we have a few clubs/teams in london who only play friendlies. Mixture of traditional fixtures + picking up games through the season. It is possible

 

[didds]

because its a huge conurbation with a lot of teams maybe ?
a few years back our 3rds looked at dropping from the league and playing friendlies but scouring the areas of D&W, Bath, S. Glos, West hants etc there were very very few fixtures available. Because everybody else had league fixtures 75% of weekends.

We onjly run two XVs now...

 

[DocP]

When the social/merit leagues first came about our 4th team tried to not enter and just continue playing friendlies. It lasted a season for, as you say @didds, we just couldn't get fixtures week in week out as everyone else had league matches. We then ended up signing up.
It was ok for a while but eventually the overall social element started to diminish as some sides started taking the "league" more seriously. Now they are pretty much in disarray as clubs lose teams and leagues have fewer sides in them. Now made worse with some of the 2nd XV being in the RFU main structure.
Overall, feels a bit of a shambles these days.

 

[didds]

To add to the above we also found the weeks we were unable to field a team, and had to offer a walk-over, in a league where our players are in iot for a social game, ended up with the club being fined. It created a huge disconnect between what 3rd XV rugby was trying to provide in a rural community, and the realities of a structured league at level 10 (at best) that was run in effect the same as the championship at level 2

 

[crossref]

To add to the above we also found the weeks we were unable to field a team, and had to offer a walk-over, in a league where our players are in iot for a social game, ended up with the club being fined. It created a huge disconnect between what 3rd XV rugby was trying to provide in a rural community, and the realities of a structured league at level 10 (at best) that was run in effect the same as the championship at level 2

that's silly.
our local merit tables are well run, pragmatic, and focussed on giving people as many games as possiblw
(IMO!)