Penalty Try

[SimonSmith]

As a penalty try is usually awarded in the Field of Play.

Walk me through it

 

[didds]

I can think of times when the PT is awarded for an action within the in goal area, but Id accept theyd be very extreme and frankly unlikely - somewhat chopperesque scenarios (I _think_ the in goal is not in the field of play! LOL)

didds

 

[buff]

I had a situation a couple of seasons ago where the attacking winger broke clear down the right tram lines into the goal area. As he ran towards the posts he was clothes lined by a defender and lost the ball. I gave a penalty try and red card. I think that was well within the mainstream of law application, and not really chopperesque.

 

[KoolFork]

Walk me through it

Does Didds reply help or was there something else?

 

[thepercy]

I had a situation a couple of seasons ago where the attacking winger broke clear down the right tram lines into the goal area. As he ran towards the posts he was clothes lined by a defender and lost the ball. I gave a penalty try and red card. I think that was well within the mainstream of law application, and not really chopperesque.

I also had an in-goal PT recently. I don't think that is so exceedingly rare that it is purely a hypothetical-never-going-to-happen.

Ball carrier running in in-goal to center the try, defending player chased from behind and made a "seat belt" tackle and prevented the grounding. It didn't seem like a rare situation.

 

[RedCapRef]

Had the seat penalty not prevented the grounding, but prevented the ball carrier going under the posts, would you have awarded the penalty try and YC then?

 

[SimonSmith]

Does Didds reply help or was there something else?

Didds' reply outlined where the act of foul play giving rise to the PT take place.

PTs are awarded between the goal posts.

 

[Dickie E]

why cannot a referee signal the award of a penalty try at the place of infringement?

there would need to be a new signal for a PT for that to work unambiguously. Ref sticks arm in air 5 metres in from touch and 5 metres out from goal line ... is he/she signaling time off, a penalty, a regular try or a PT?

 

[Marc Wakeham]

Had the seat penalty not prevented the grounding, but prevented the ball carrier going under the posts, would you have awarded the penalty try and YC then?

Why not?

 

[Marc Wakeham]

there would need to be a new signal for a PT for that to work unambiguously. Ref sticks arm in air 5 metres in from touch and 5 metres out from goal line ... is he/she signaling time off, a penalty, a regular try or a PT?

Indeed. After all a side can decline a conversion attempt. Therfore, the lack of one is not conclusive evidence of a PT.

 

[Flish]

Interestingly (not sure if anyone saw it live so not sure on the exact ref positioning) there was a YC and PT in this weeks Sale vs Leicester game, and from the highlights, after a TMO chat, it looked like the ref just called player over, YC, communicated PT, arm up in the air and jogged back - didn't look like under the sticks at all.

 

[Dickie E]

Why not?

I guess the bloke with the sore neck would rather have the 5 points on his club record

 

[Dickie E]

Interestingly (not sure if anyone saw it live so not sure on the exact ref positioning) there was a YC and PT in this weeks Sale vs Leicester game, and from the highlights, after a TMO chat, it looked like the ref just called player over, YC, communicated PT, arm up in the air and jogged back - didn't look like under the sticks at all.

Geez, I wish you hadn't posted that. Crossref the Influencer will be insufferable

 

[didds]

I guess the bloke with the sore neck would rather have the 5 points on his club record

i reckon... I "scored" a PT once (tap and charge at a 5m PK, tackled by a player not retreated to goal line etc).

It didnt "feel" like I'd scored.

didds

 

[KoolFork]

Indeed. After all a side can decline a conversion attempt. Therfore, the lack of one is not conclusive evidence of a PT.

That is true, but how often does it happen in the modern 15-a-side game? A quick drop-kick is more common. We didn't always bother when I was a schoolboy as the ball usually weighed a ton after 10 minutes on the water-logged pitches at Blackweir.

Given that normal tries are usually signalled on the goal line in line with the point where they are scored, the award of a try anywhere else (whether in the field of play of in goal) shouldn't be that confusing. (I accept that where there is a heap of bodies this is not always true.) There might be some confusion if the PT was awarded on the goal line, but referees could be told to signal such tries from the field of play - maybe any PT in goal or close to the goal line could be signalled on the 5m line.

Also, wrt to Dickie E's point, who are we talking about? The teams or the crowd? I accept there might be some confusion in the crowd at lower level matches. The referee can talk so the players would know it was a penalty try. In first class games the score board would show 7 points too. Probably broadcast over the PA. There would also be the likelihood of a YC.

You also don't trot back to the middle after time off (do referees signal to timekeepers in lower level matches?) or after a penalty. There are also secondary referee signals at most penalties.

I'm sure someone will come up with other scenarios, but my original question was whether PTs were signalled under the posts by convention. I'm guessing it was also done because that signalled the point of the conversion attempt.

It would seem sensible to me to keep the referee close to the action. After all, there will have been some foul play involved.

 

[Dickie E]

I'm guessing it was also done because that signalled the point of the conversion attempt.

that's true enough

 

[thepercy]

Had the seat penalty not prevented the grounding, but prevented the ball carrier going under the posts, would you have awarded the penalty try and YC then?

.Yes.

 

[thepercy]

there would need to be a new signal for a PT for that to work unambiguously. Ref sticks arm in air 5 metres in from touch and 5 metres out from goal line ... is he/she signaling time off, a penalty, a regular try or a PT?

For PTs we could use the Grid Iron Touch Down signal




or maybe the Aussie rules score signal X7

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=evKm4kstZqM

 

[Marc Wakeham]

I guess the bloke with the sore neck would rather have the 5 points on his club record

His team might prefer the extras if their kicker is crap.

 

[thepercy]

I guess the bloke with the sore neck would rather have the 5 points on his club record

Sir, I'd prefer the Try to the PT, I have a points bonus in my contract, thanks.