Penalty Try

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tim White


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"A Penalty Try IS a Penalty Try" no choice. I have a 'Get it right" clause in my contract.
 

Phil E


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In answer to the OP

Yes the ref has to run under the posts to signal a penalty try. It tells everyone that there wont be a conversion required and more importantly that the Ref has seen whatever skulduggery took place.

The bit about running away from an incident is just smoke screen, the ref can separate the teams, deal with the incident, issue any cards and signal the try as the final act once everything else is dealt with. On the pitch he can tell the team captains there is a penalty try coming so they know what's happening in advance. The signal under the posts is mainly for the benefit of the spectators.

This is something that used to be called Referee Protection. If everyone knows what happening it protects you from any flak, which mainly comes from people NOT knowing what's happening.
 

Marc Wakeham


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In answer to the OP

Yes the ref has to run under the posts to signal a penalty try. It tells everyone that there wont be a conversion required and more importantly that the Ref has seen whatever skulduggery took place.

The bit about running away from an incident is just smoke screen, the ref can separate the teams, deal with the incident, issue any cards and signal the try as the final act once everything else is dealt with. On the pitch he can tell the team captains there is a penalty try coming so they know what's happening in advance. The signal under the posts is mainly for the benefit of the spectators.

This is something that used to be called Referee Protection. If everyone knows what happening it protects you from any flak, which mainly comes from people NOT knowing what's happening.

Exactly as stated earlier in the thread :

Camquin said:
Moving under the posts is conventionally how you indicate to the crowd it is a penalty try, but you can whistle, deal with any potential flare up and then go under the posts.

Spot on. Should have been the approach when ther was a conversion required. NEVER leave the potential flashpoint unobserved.
 
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Decorily

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................flak, which mainly comes from people NOT knowing what's happening.

And also from people who don't know what's supposed to be happening! !
 

crossref


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well I think we all strongly agree that running away at a critical moment is a poor idea.

but I am in a minority when I say that the Law that requires the ref to run off could be reconsidered.
 

Phil E


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...but I am in a minority when I say that the Law that requires the ref to run off could be reconsidered.

I think more to the point the law doesn't require the ref to "run off" at all.
It requires him to signal the penalty try, but doesn't stipulate it has to be done straight away.

[LAWS]PENALTY TRY
A penalty try is awarded between the goal posts[/LAWS]

[LAWS]Match Official Signals - Try and Penalty Try
Referee’s back to dead-ball line. Arm raised vertically.[/LAWS]
 

Marc Wakeham


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...but I am in a minority when I say that the Law that requires the ref to run off could be reconsidered.

That is because the law requires no such thing. You are making things up to suit your narrative again!
 

crossref


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I think more to the point the law doesn't require the ref to "run off" at all.
[/LAWS]

In answer to the OP

Yes the ref has to run under the posts to signal a penalty try. .

.

and as I said earlier --

shrug - my question was prompted by watching Luke Pearce on TV running away from the action ... in order to award a PT...

anyway --- it was only an idle thought (not a 'narrative' Marc) . I thought a harmless idea, no big deal.
 
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Marc Wakeham


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Whether Luke Pearce was "running away" does not mean that referees are required to " run off". So either you know that but choose the ignore the truth. OR you are failing to grasp something basic.

I will let you decide which one it is.
 

didds

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presumabkly just becasue Luke Pearce does it doesnt mean its right ?

aside from having two Ars and a TMO with video to refer to if boys/girls will be boys/girls
 

didds

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i think we all agree it's not right.
so why does it happen ?

I refer the honourable gentlemean to the suggestiion i made a few hours ago...

(which IMO doesnt make it right)
 

Marc Wakeham


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i think we all agree it's not right.
so why does it happen ?

Well you made the absurd claim:

but I am in a minority when I say that the Law that requires the ref to run off could be reconsidered.

YOU claim it happens because the law demands it.

Which is not right at all (So why did that happen).

I (and others) claim that it happens due to a moment of poor management.


To get back the the point. It is not good management to leave a a potential flashpoint. WR probably expects referees to use common sense when interpreting the rules. Clearly you do not have to "run away" from the scene. You can deal with the immediate issue and then go under the posts.

You'd have to ask Luke P why he "ran away"(as you put it).
 

Marc Wakeham


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but I am in a minority when I say that the Law that requires the ref to run off could be reconsidered.


Where does the law book state the referee must "run off" to award the PT rather than deal with "afters" / card etc and then move calmly to under the posts to award the PT?
 
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crossref


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shrug, part of good management is to make it clear that a try is being awarded (calms down the non-offending team), and the law is unhelpful here as this has to be done under the posts.

current law

[LAWS]Penalty try

8.3 A penalty try is awarded between the goal posts if foul play by the opposing team prevents a probable try from being scored, or scored in a more advantageous position.[/LAWS]

propsoal


[LAWS]Penalty try

8.3 A penalty try is awarded if foul play by the opposing team prevents a probable try from being scored, or scored in a more advantageous position.[/LAWS]

simpler, more flexible, removes a constraint on the referee.

the whole 'under the posts' idea came because a conversion was going to follow, so the PT had to have a 'location' for the kick which is no longer the case
 
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OB..


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shrug, part of good management is to make it clear that a try is being awarded (calms down the non-offending team), and the law is unhelpful here as this has to be done under the posts.

current law

[LAWS]Penalty try

8.3 A penalty try is awarded between the goal posts if foul play by the opposing team prevents a probable try from being scored, or scored in a more advantageous position.[/LAWS]

propsoal


[LAWS]Penalty try

8.3 A penalty try is awarded if foul play by the opposing team prevents a probable try from being scored, or scored in a more advantageous position.[/LAWS]

simpler, more flexible, removes a constraint on the referee.

the whole 'under the posts' idea came because a conversion was going to follow, so the PT had to have a 'location' for the kick which is no longer the case
A solution in search of a problem?
 

Marc Wakeham


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shrug, part of good management is to make it clear that a try is being awarded (calms down the non-offending team), and the law is unhelpful here as this has to be done under the posts.

current law

[LAWS]Penalty try

8.3 A penalty try is awarded between the goal posts if foul play by the opposing team prevents a probable try from being scored, or scored in a more advantageous position.[/LAWS]

propsoal


[LAWS]Penalty try

8.3 A penalty try is awarded if foul play by the opposing team prevents a probable try from being scored, or scored in a more advantageous position.[/LAWS]

simpler, more flexible, removes a constraint on the referee.

the whole 'under the posts' idea came because a conversion was going to follow, so the PT had to have a 'location' for the kick which is no longer the case

Well done in totally avoiding answering the actual question. You are not an MP by any chance are you?

To remind you.

YOU insisted, as the quote shows, that the referee had to run from the "flashpoint" immediately. The law however, does not agree with you. All the law says is that the "Award" under the posts. No time scale is refered to., either tacitly or by actual wording. You seem unable / willing to admit that claim was not true. I wonder why?

As OB state you are trying to create "A solution in search of a problem".
 

Dickie E


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to be fair, the OP saw a (potentially) safety-related oddity on a televised game and wondered if there was a better way - especially since no conversion now required. We should always be open to new ideas.
 

crossref


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to be fair, the OP saw a (potentially) safety-related oddity on a televised game and wondered if there was a better way - especially since no conversion now required. We should always be open to new ideas.

Perfectly put Dickie
 
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