[Line out] Pro14 Munster versus Ulster

L'irlandais

, Promises to Referee in France
Joined
May 11, 2010
Messages
4,724
Post Likes
325
After five minutes of play
Ulster's line-speed making it hard for Munster to spread the ball wide. Luke Marshall steps in and makes an interception and then Cooney swiftly kicks - he's in Faf de Klerk mood - behind the Munster winger.

However, he misjudges and the ball finds touch on the full. Back for a Munster lineout close to halfway.
Ulster’s substitutes were very “helpful” in catching the ball as it lands in touch. Effectively, preventing the Munster cover from taking a quick throw in, despite Red being on the spot.

Is there any thing the match ref can do to dissuade the bench from this sort of gamesmanship?
Not cynical, but done in full knowledge that it prevents the quick throw.
 

Decorily

Coach/Referee
Joined
May 3, 2013
Messages
1,556
Post Likes
423
Current Referee grade:
Select Grade
If they were in their tec zone I can't really see that it was 'wrong'
 

crossref


Referees in England
Joined
Sep 14, 2009
Messages
21,805
Post Likes
3,145
After five minutes of play
Ulster's line-speed making it hard for Munster to spread the ball wide. Luke Marshall steps in and makes an interception and then Cooney swiftly kicks - he's in Faf de Klerk mood - behind the Munster winger.

However, he misjudges and the ball finds touch on the full. Back for a Munster lineout close to halfway.
Ulster’s substitutes were very “helpful” in catching the ball as it lands in touch. Effectively, preventing the Munster cover from taking a quick throw in, despite Red being on the spot.

Is there any thing the match ref can do to dissuade the bench from this sort of gamesmanship?
Not cynical, but done in full knowledge that it prevents the quick throw.

Yes , Alain Rolland (I think it was) once gave Will Skinner a RC for doing that (after a previous warning to a physio for the same thing

(And it IS cycnical!)
 

Jarrod Burton


Referees in Australia
Joined
Jun 19, 2013
Messages
725
Post Likes
208
Current Referee grade:
Level 2
Is it cynical if players in a tech zone don't move and the ball hits them - surely we aren't expecting players who are in the area (that we tell them they are required to be in) to move out of that space in order to avoid a ball.
 
Last edited:

Marc Wakeham


Referees in Wales
Joined
Jan 5, 2018
Messages
2,778
Post Likes
842
Current Referee grade:
Level 2
Outside the roped off area.

We had a memo sent out on Friday on the subject.
 

L'irlandais

, Promises to Referee in France
Joined
May 11, 2010
Messages
4,724
Post Likes
325
At Thomond Park it’s East terrace - either side of the tunnel at halfway.

On such a bitterly cold night it’s not unusual to see the substitutes warming up on the side line. Subs are not taking part in the game, and so it’s unsportsmanlike to prevent a player from taking advantage of his opportunity to take a quick throw in and exploit one of the rare errors from the opposition’s fly half. Kicking it out on the full, means most of the opposition team are not expecting a counterattack at that moment in time.

Panorama
 
Last edited:

Jarrod Burton


Referees in Australia
Joined
Jun 19, 2013
Messages
725
Post Likes
208
Current Referee grade:
Level 2
Kicking it out on the full, means most of the opposition team are not expecting a counterattack at that moment in time.

Any coach worth their salt would be bashing it into their players that unless the ball is dead - be ready for a counter attack.
 

Camquin

Rugby Expert
Joined
Mar 8, 2011
Messages
1,653
Post Likes
310
I was watching blue v red on Saturday (level 3). Blue kick penalty. Red winger jumps, knock it back into play where red full back caught it, and counter attacked. Blue caught flat footed and led to a score.
 

L'irlandais

, Promises to Referee in France
Joined
May 11, 2010
Messages
4,724
Post Likes
325
Yes , Alain Rolland (I think it was) once gave Will Skinner a RC for doing that (after a previous warning to a physio for the same thing

(And it IS cycnical!)
In pro rugby, very little happens without premeditation. I doubt my incident with make Tuesday’s highlight reel however.
 

L'irlandais

, Promises to Referee in France
Joined
May 11, 2010
Messages
4,724
Post Likes
325
As suspected nothing in the highlights reel. Other than for Red’s second try you can see the Ulster substitutes warming up in the other in-goal, in the background. And at the end of the game you can see them milling around behind the technical area.
 

L'irlandais

, Promises to Referee in France
Joined
May 11, 2010
Messages
4,724
Post Likes
325
Well I finally managed to get hold of a full match replay. At that moment of the game the substitutes are all seated 7 or 8 meters from the touchline. It is actually the “water carrier” who gets up off his seat in the technical area.
, leans out over the line delimiting the area to touch the ball in flight; a mere fraction of a second before the Munster winger would have caught the ball. Very much like the situation where Alain Rolland told the Quin’s physio it was well out of order. Given that at the subsequent lineout 5 meters inside Munster’s half that “ water carrier” (with a headset in his ears obviously) was barking out long winded instructions to the Ulster pack as they lined up, I feel sure his actions were malicious. (Ulster coaching staff, shame on you.)

That said, if the subs had been allowed keep warm on the touchline, personally I would not expect them to behave in such a manner. RC? This was a game, which went on to have a lot (LOT) of niggle, and I think much of it was down to the laxity of the match referee. Of course, it’s easier not to call the water carrier over, of course it’s easier to pretend we don’t hear him coaching the players. However it does nothing for the game to take the easy road.
 
Last edited:

crossref


Referees in England
Joined
Sep 14, 2009
Messages
21,805
Post Likes
3,145
For context, in the Quins game it happened (I think) three times, making the crowd mad.
The physio received a warning
Then when it happened again, Skinner got the card
 
Top