Resetting Clock after TMO intervention

Ciaran Trainor

Ciaran Trainor


Referees in England
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I've seen a couple of incidents where after a try has been scored or play has stopped the TMO informs the ref that there has been a knock on or penalty offence prior to play stopping and they need to have a look at it.
These can result in scrum/penalty or card awards but should the clock in the professional game be reset to when the offence occurred?
Play could go on for well over a minute after the offence and it seems to me that in a tight game with crucial calls elapsed time matters and could decide a match.
For me it should be reset as the technology is there.
Any thoughts?
 
i sympathise with your thoughts, but TBH its so subjective as to what time needs adding on etc etc.
 
You have a point CT. Seems easy to do.


Try scored at 67:43 Review show an offence by scoring side at 66:10. Just reset the clock to 66:10. Seems simple enough.
 
Ciaran Trainor said:
For me it should be reset as the technology is there.
Any thoughts?
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From experience, this is not the case.

For the matches where I've been a timekeeper (several MLR games and a test match), there's the official time, the time on the stadium clock, and the time on the broadcast feed, and they are controlled by different people. The app that we were required to use, the running game clock cannot be manually reset or wound back.

If you're resetting game clock, then if there is a YC or 20min RC, those clocks have to be reset as well, which further complicates getting everything back on track.
 
It's time that the official clock was patched in to the other timers. The card clock should be accurate to the official clock as well. This should not beyond the abilities of the tech guys. If it is maybe they are not the right tech guys.

The broadcast and stadium feeds are pointless if not accurate. Or does it suit the broadcaster etc to have controversy?
 
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Marc Wakeham said:
It's time that theofficial clock was ptched in to the other timers. The card clock should be accurate to theofficial clock as well. This should not beyond the abilities of the tech guys. If it is maybe they are not the right tech guys.

The broadcast and stadium feeds are pointless if not accurate. Or does it suit the broadcaster etc to have controversy?
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When I was involved in timekeeping, the broadcast/stadium feeds would be adjusted as necessary. The broadcaster is making the best of the situation, and so are the officials.

The tech *people* aren't the issue, it's the tech itself - you want WR and every top-flight club comp to develop technology that will work in every single stadium setup and with every third-party streaming/broadcasting platform. The tech people that *could* do this clearly do not work in rugby, and the money isn't there to pay such people what it would take to build and maintain a *quality* product along these lines.
 
It's a simple link up and it need not cost much . It really is not that dificult to achieve. Where there is a will and all that. The broadcasters have plenty of tech knowhow to do it. What is the point of having clocks that are in disagreement? especially now we have shot clocks as well. Accuracy is important.

Either show the correct time of remove it from display.

You don't need every top flight club to develop anything. WR and the broadcaster work together and it is an easy solve. One development and then it is rolled out.
 
Smeagol's experience is the same as mine. Bumping in the TV infrastructure in some stadia takes days (think Hong Kong 7s for example). The local clock is the last thing on anyone's mind. The local clock may be hard-wired to a switch and can't be connected to the TV clock.
Often too there is a local timekeeper who has been doing it for years or has been given the job as a reward for years of service (looking at you Twickenham). He's not going to be bumped for some johnny-come-lately TV button pusher
 
Often too there will be a contractual issue.
The internal displays (big screen, advertising, ground announcing, stadium clock) will be "owned" by a different company (possibly a competitor) to the TV broadcaster
 
Marc Wakeham said:
It's a simple link up and it need not cost much . It really is not that dificult to achieve. Where there is a will and all that. The broadcasters have plenty of tech knowhow to do it. What is the point of having clocks that are in disagreement? especially now we have shot clocks as well. Accuracy is important.

Either show the correct time of remove it from display.

You don't need every top flight club to develop anything. WR and the broadcaster work together and it is an easy solve. One development and then it is rolled out.
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During the USA/ROM match, the clock normally shown within the stadium was turned off. The panel that controlled the stadium clock was in the broadcast room in a corner of the stadium on the second level, and I ended up having to sit next to the Red Hat in the technical zone pitchside. Me (literally using a timing app on my phone) - Red Hat - Production Crew outside the stadium - person operating the display in Texas.

For MLR games I have done, the timekeeper has a walkie-talkie so that they can talk to the person who runs the stadium clock that is visible on the LED displays from throughout the stadium - I have no idea who controls the clock for the broadcast/stream. I assume they're operating out of the same broadcast room.

If you can figure out a universal solution that works, you could probably make a good amount of money doing so.
 
smeagol said:
If you can figure out a universal solution that works, you could probably make a good amount of money doing so.
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Not sure about that. Apart from those in this chat, I doubt that there would be a sense that this is a problem worth solving.
"Guys, it's not that hard. When the ref signals time on, push the green button. When the ref signals time off, push the red button. Doesn't matter that you're in different locations, can't see each others clocks & can't talk to each other"
 
Dickie E said:
Smeagol's experience is the same as mine. Bumping in the TV infrastructure in some stadia takes days (think Hong Kong 7s for example). The local clock is the last thing on anyone's mind. The local clock may be hard-wired to a switch and can't be connected to the TV clock.
Often too there is a local timekeeper who has been doing it for years or has been given the job as a reward for years of service (looking at you Twickenham). He's not going to be bumped for some johnny-come-lately TV button pusher
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It's my experience tht that does not happen here at the serious end. I am not saying that currently it is doable. I am saying thtthe clocks should and could be connected. There is no point in an inaccurate clock. With Wifi and all the Tech the TV companies have this is eaily solvable. The problem is that the game is still a bumbling amateur one underneath the pro facade
 
smeagol said:
During the USA/ROM match, the clock normally shown within the stadium was turned off. The panel that controlled the stadium clock was in the broadcast room in a corner of the stadium on the second level, and I ended up having to sit next to the Red Hat in the technical zone pitchside. Me (literally using a timing app on my phone) - Red Hat - Production Crew outside the stadium - person operating the display in Texas.

For MLR games I have done, the timekeeper has a walkie-talkie so that they can talk to the person who runs the stadium clock that is visible on the LED displays from throughout the stadium - I have no idea who controls the clock for the broadcast/stream. I assume they're operating out of the same broadcast room.

If you can figure out a universal solution that works, you could probably make a good amount of money doing so.
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And thst all proves what an amateur set up we have. No disrespect to those working with it. But we have to power but not the will to change.
 
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In the Premiership at Tigers there is ONE clock.
The timekeepers clock is the time that's displayed on the big screens, and on the tv pictures (its all the same feed).
The shot clock is controlled by the timekeeper and displays on the big screens and on the pitchside advertising boards.

The only clock not controlled by the timekeeper is the yellow cards. That's controlled by the 4th official.
 
Phil E said:
In the Premiership at Tigers there is ONE clock.
The timekeepers clock is the time that's displayed on the big screens, and on the tv pictures (its all the same feed).
The shot clock is controlled by the timekeeper and displays on the big screens and on the pitchside advertising boards.

The only clock not controlled by the timekeeper is the yellow cards. That's controlled by the 4th official.
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So it can be done. Amazing!
 
"If you can figure out a universal solution that works, you could probably make a good amount of money doing so."

That kinda suggested otherwise.

We are talking high profile games. Internationals big cup finals etc. Not games in the sticks here. TV has the tech. Unions need to work WITH them.If TV says jump Unionsnormally ask: "How high?"
 
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Marc Wakeham said:
"If you can figure out a universal solution that works, you could probably make a good amount of money doing so."

Tat kinda suggested otherwise.

We are talking high profile games. Internationals big cup finals etc. Not games in the sticks here. TV has the tech. Unions need to work WITH them.If TV says jump Unionsnormally ask: "How high?"
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Tell that to USAR
 
That your union is prepared to be amateurish perhaps says a lot about its ambition. Clearly we have come to a conclusion that it is possible but the USA is not up to the pace. No point in discussing it further. i'm out.
 
Marc Wakeham said:
That your union is prepared to be amateurish perhaps says a lot about its ambition. Clearly we have come to a conclusion that it is possible but the USA is not up to the pace. No point in discussing it further. i'm out.
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Ah, the bliss of ignorance :)

There is so much wrong with USAR that interaction with the tv stuff doesn't break into the top 25 of things to do.
 
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