I am finding some of these definitions very hard to manage in a game situation.when the ball is, or is not, out of a ruck, maul or scrum is such a fundamental part of rugby, that it is hard to fathom why it is left to individual referees' interpretation. "hands on", "lifted up", "bird could shit on it", "outside rubber band" etc, etc ... SMH
But if the ball is "clearly won" what difference does it make whether they use their hands or not? Contest over ....get on with the game!I penalised a SH recently for pulling the ball back with his hands through a caterpillar. I had warned him earlier in the game not to use his hands to do this, he chose to ignore me so was penalised.
I’m happy for the SH to dig around with his hands, but if the ball is clearly won and on the floor, he shouldn’t use his hands at that point to get the ball In the ideal position.
But a caterpillar ruck is not getting on with the game ...
A fair point, but we allow the 9 to handle the ball, and even move offside, when we don’t allow that to other players. I understand about keeping the game flowing and whether it really matters, but for me I’m trying to make sure they don’t take the p*ss as they do it.
If the ball is clearly won then the ref should call use it. The SH now has 5 secs to use it
I'm not saying 'clearly won' and available are the same thing.If the ball is clearly won then the ref should call use it. The SH now has 5 secs to use it
If the SH then wants to create an ideal situation so that he can easily clear the ball.
We shouldn't allow the SH to move the ball with his hands in order to facilitate this.
I want them to do as you say "get on with the game" facilitating them to create a boring caterpillar doesn't do this imo
I don't think it would. A SH placing one foot in front of the rearmost feet at a normal ruck isn't significantly impacting the game and makes recycling the ball accurately to his team easier, especially to players behind the first line (ie kickers)Law 15.4
Each team has an offside line that runs parallel to the goal line through the hindmost point of any ruck participant. If that point is on or behind the goal line, the offside line for that team is the goal line.
So if a SH steps in front of the back foot they are offside.
Applying that law would solve all of the issues associated with caterpillar rucks.
No new laws or guidance required just have the elite refs apply the laws and we would have a much cleaner and simpler game....just saying