[Tackle] Tackling from the ground.

[Huck2Spit]

Encounter this a few times in women's tourney other day. Not 100% sure of it.
A Ball carrier running along gets caught by a defender and wrapped but not brought down, still on their feet trudging forward. Defender/ tackler in attempting to bring them to ground drops to their knees. Putting their full weight on the runner. If that works and they both go to ground, a tackle, that's seems fine.
But it wasn't always working, so there'd be a ball carrier with an opponent being dragged along on their knees.
I'd call "release her, your off your feet/your on the ground"
..... I'm not sure why.B
I briefly looked at law 15--says a ball carrier kneeling has been tackled and brought to ground.... so if a tackler is kneeling same logic would imply right?

 

[OB..]

Encounter this a few times in women's tourney other day. Not 100% sure of it.
A Ball carrier running along gets caught by a defender and wrapped but not brought down, still on their feet trudging forward. Defender/ tackler in attempting to bring them to ground drops to their knees. Putting their full weight on the runner. If that works and they both go to ground, a tackle, that's seems fine.
But it wasn't always working, so there'd be a ball carrier with an opponent being dragged along on their knees.
I'd call "release her, your off your feet/your on the ground"
..... I'm not sure why.B
I briefly looked at law 15--says a ball carrier kneeling has been tackled and brought to ground.... so if a tackler is kneeling same logic would imply right?

I don't think anybody expects that to be penalised nor does the would-be tackler get told to release.

Applying logic to the laws is a dodgy business!

 

[Fatboy_Ginge]

How many times did Jonah Lomu have people hanging off his socks with legs on the ground trying to tackle him? None of them were told to release. If anything they were told to hang on.

 

[Huck2Spit]

I don't think anybody expects that to be penalised nor does the would-be tackler get told to release

Law 14(D) a player on the ground must not tackle or attempt to tackle an opponent. Sanction PK.
....
I'd assume ( maybe foolishly) being on one's knees equals on the ground as it does for a ball carrier.

While a PK seems unnecessary. Asking them to release??? They are not on their feet!

 

[Fatboy_Ginge]

Law 14(D) a player on the ground must not tackle or attempt to tackle an opponent. Sanction PK.
....
I'd assume ( maybe foolishly) being on one's knees equals on the ground as it does for a ball carrier.

While a PK seems unnecessary. Asking them to release??? They are not on their feet!

The context of that law is to prevent a player ALREADY on the ground from tackling another one. for example Red 7 tackles Blue 10 and bring him to ground but Blue 10 offloads to another Blue player in support. At the same time Red 7 releases Blue 10 as he is supposed to but whilst still on his knees or on the ground tackles the player Blue 10 has offloaded to. In order to make that tackle legally he must get back to his feet first. As he's still on the ground it's foul play and a PK is awarded against him.

In your scenario the tackle hasn't completed as the ball carrier is still on their feet. Hence no PK OR the tackler having to release the ball carrier.

 

[Huck2Spit]

The context of that law.

??
Sure it's not in 15-- the tackle law. But also lists no caveats for exception.

My, albeit dodgy, logical thinking during the tournament was along the lines:
If a defense is attempting a hold a ball carrier up to create an unproductive maul and get the scrum-- maybe heard it called choke tackle/ ball. The carrier can get a knee to ground, before it's a maul, hence he's on the ground= tackled and tackler(s) must release.
So by that same rational... if a tackler attempting to tackle goes to ground, by kneeling. They must release, not on their feet.

 

[ChrisR]

Huck, re-read post #2.

 

[Phil E]

Huck, you were wrong to call release. They are allowed to complete the tackle. The law you are trying to invoke is for players already on the ground to attempt to start a tackle.

You will probably be the only ref in the world refereeing the tackle this way!

Sometimes you just have to accept you got it wrong.

 

[Huck2Spit]

Ok, ok I understand. However what I was seeing then didn't seem proper-- wish I had video to fully get it across.
Anyway, I saw this in match I did last week:
Blue defender goes to tackle green BC, green breaks the attempted tackle and blue 'tackler' ends up on the floor flat on his back. But Blue managed to still be holding a handful of green's jersey and, after a few seconds of both struggling, pulled BC to ground....is that then a tackle? Or what? didn't quite look proper.

 

[DocY]

Ok, ok I understand. However what I was seeing then didn't seem proper-- wish I had video to fully get it across.
Anyway, I saw this in match I did last week:
Blue defender goes to tackle green BC, green breaks the attempted tackle and blue 'tackler' ends up on the floor flat on his back. But Blue managed to still be holding a handful of green's jersey and, after a few seconds of both struggling, pulled BC to ground....is that then a tackle? Or what? didn't quite look proper.

Tackle to me. Quite usual in the age grades.

As others pointed out - the law prevents someone starting to make a tackle when they're on the ground. It's not intended to penalise hangers-on.

In the case you describe, I'd only penalise if he'd completely fallen off, then grabbed the BC again.