Time wasting

crossref


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Various reports in the press today that WR agree with Australia's complaints
 

shebeen

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To those Aussie commentators (Horan, Kearns, Martin et al) claiming they have never, ever in their careers previously seen a turnover of possession awarded by a referee for delaying the game, I'm just going to go right ahead and call BS on that! They may not have seen this precise scenario involving a PK being kicked for touch, but I'll bet dollars to donuts that they have at least seen a scrum-half get FK for delaying the put in to a scrum, or the hooker get FK delaying the throw in to a lineout.



Strange. I always thought the laws of the game applied equally at any time in the game... from the opening whistle to no-side.
You missed Andrew Mehrtens in your list of Aussie commentators btw.

I'm not sure how many people noticed that the put in to the final scrum was skew, right in front of the ref too. Surely he should have blown that up since it appears every law needs to be applied at every transgression?
 

Phil E


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How can World Rugby say the referee made an error when they wrote the law that says the ref is the sole judge?
 

Dickie E


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SimonSmith


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Takes note that Dave Rennie claims. Pardon me if I don't take that at face value.

We can argue about seconds here, skew scrum feeds, every trangression needing a penalty all we like, but it strikes me - and I say this supporting Australia - that this boils down to Foley fucking about and finding out. Play silly games, win silly prizes.
 

crossref


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How can World Rugby say the referee made an error when they wrote the law that says the ref is the sole judge?
It's not about a Law error, it's about whether there was an error of judgement
 

Volun-selected


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Has anyone seen an official WRU response? I’ve seen several variations of ‘“They agreed with our concerns,” Rennie said.’

Exactly which concerns? The application of law, communication, general management, stopping the match, the restart, equity of officiating, etc?

And did RA accept that they were taking more time on restarts than NZ in that match?

(Maybe one solution would be for us refs to be advised to call “use it” as the final warning and then everyone knows they have 5 seconds? Or maybe “be allowed to use” since laws only mention the call for ruck, maul, and scrum.)
 

Phil E


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Experienced just means they've been doing it a long time.

That statement was mad before I had seen all the stats about time taken by both teams..
 

Rich_NL

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How can World Rugby say the referee made an error when they wrote the law that says the ref is the sole judge?
... of fact and of law during a match.

The judgements they make can be found to be in error afterwards, but while the match is on no-one has any right within the law to dissent from the opinion or attempt to correct things.
 

Phil E


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... of fact and of law during a match.

The judgements they make can be found to be in error afterwards, but while the match is on no-one has any right within the law to dissent from the opinion or attempt to correct things.

Fair point.
 

crossref


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I really don't think this is a Law question.
MR certainly had enough Law on his side to do what he did.
He also had enough Law on his side to have kept the watch off until the kick.

I just prefer the second option
 
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crossref


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That statement was mad before I had seen all the stats about time taken by both teams..
It was your first reaction, and your instinct was good.
I don't think you would have got into the mess MR did
 

Ian_Cook


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Various reports in the press today that WR agree with Australia's complaints
All those reports come from Australian news sources, and their source is Dave Rennie saying what he claims he was told... i.o.w. hearsay

I will take notice when this information comes directly from WR themselves.

Also, this has come to light today. Foley may well have instigated the the whole time wasting situation earler in the game by wilfully disregarding clear and direct instructions from the referee not to kick the conversion of Kelloway's try... three time, he has ignored Raynal's instructions to wait!


"Raynal clearly told Foley to “please wait” as the Australian No.10, playing his first Test since the 2019 World Cup, lined up a shot in a matter of seconds where he successfully converted.​
“Wait please. You have to wait. You have to wait!” Raynal said.​
Nonetheless, the French referee did not take any action, instead allowing the conversion to stand as Foley ran back into his half.​
While rarely do kickers actively ignore instructions from referees, quick kicks are often taken when there is an element of fear tries might be overturned or when teams are chasing the game."​
 
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Dickie E


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Also, this has come to light today. Foley may well have instigated the the whole time wasting situation earler in the game by wilfully disregarding clear and direct instructions from the referee not to kick the conversion of Kelloway's try... three time, he has ignored Raynal's instructions to wait!


"Raynal clearly told Foley to “please wait” as the Australian No.10, playing his first Test since the 2019 World Cup, lined up a shot in a matter of seconds where he successfully converted.​
“Wait please. You have to wait. You have to wait!” Raynal said.​
Nonetheless, the French referee did not take any action, instead allowing the conversion to stand as Foley ran back into his half.​
While rarely do kickers actively ignore instructions from referees, quick kicks are often taken when there is an element of fear tries might be overturned or when teams are chasing the game."​
I didn't know that. Just confirms how clearly out of his depth the Frenchman was. If he wanted Foley to wait he should have blown time off and done it properly. A full house at this stadium with the roof closed is not the place for meek & mild requests.
 

Ian_Cook


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I agree that he should have blown time off to check with the TMO, but there is still no excuse for Foley's behaviour. There have been arguments that Raynal's decision to award NZ a scrum at the end was not in the spirit of the game, but what Foley did isn't either. He willfully disregarded a direct instruction from the referee to wait, and I know exactly why he did that. He knew that the last pass he gave to the try-scorer Kelloway was likely forward, and he wanted to get the conversion taken to stop the referee checking with the TMO.

This is another case where the Law is an ass. The goal kicker should not have the ability to limit the referee's actions. The referee should be allowed to consult the TMO (or the TMO should be able to call-in) any time after the try has been scored, and before the half-way restart.
 

Dickie E


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This is another case where the Law is an ass. The goal kicker should not have the ability to limit the referee's actions. The referee should be allowed to consult the TMO (or the TMO should be able to call-in) any time after the try has been scored, and before the half-way restart.
But he can do that. Blow the whistle, call time off and it doesn't matter what Foley does then. We're all very happy to support the mantra of "play to the whistle" except when we're not.
 

Rich_NL

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But he can do that. Blow the whistle, call time off and it doesn't matter what Foley does then. We're all very happy to support the mantra of "play to the whistle" except when we're not.
But if he blows time on again, it's still his fault when Foley doesn't follow his instructions and then gets penalised.

Is one lens green and the other gold, or are they mixed? ;)
 
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