Time wasting

[Dickie E]

good point

I used to timekeep for Super Rugby and there were plenty of times the ref forgot to say "time on" so I used my own good judgement.

It would have been easy for the French ref to say to Foley & the timekeeper "we will go 'time on' when you kick the ball" and we would have had a civilised & non-controversial end to the game.

 

[Rich_NL]

The final call of the match was a gotcha and made the match about refereeing/the referee rather than let the game shine.

And if Foley had taken the kick half as quickly as he took the conversion after his forward pass for a try, that wouldn't have happened

 

[Jarrod Burton]

I've seen some footage showing Mo'unga take 89 seconds for a PK at goal in the 71st minute when they went ahead - why wasn't this disallowed if Reynard was worried about time wasting? The whole thing smacks of gotcha and the referee wanting to be bigger than the players.

 

[SimonSmith]

Foley didn't hear the referee? My fat fucking arse he didn't.

As I said, there is a great picture of one his treammates -Leota? - behind him, and further away from the referee, who was not talking in his direction. Leota clearly knows what has happened because he is giving Foley the hurry up in no uncertain terms.

Foley, as I said, gambled, and his forwards screwed him. It was horrible game management from Gold, with zero contextual awareness. The right answer was to ckick the ball in to row ZZ, and walk very slowly to the lineout. Let the clock expire there, flat throw to pod 1, straight to 9 who kicks it out. If Gold don't have that play in their toolkit, that's just shabby.

 

[crossref]

Agreed.
Teams surely must war game out some last minute scenarios , so that they don't have to make plans on the hoof

 

[didds]

Agreed.
Teams surely must war game out some last minute scenarios , so that they don't have to make plans on the hoof

we did at U16 community level!

 

[Dickie E]

Agreed.
Teams surely must war game out some last minute scenarios , so that they don't have to make plans on the hoof

not sure how you'd do this given the limitless combinations & permutations of field position, time remaining, restart type, score margin, etc

 

[crossref]

not sure how you'd do this given the limitless combinations & permutations of field position, time remaining, restart type, score margin, etc

That's worth a new thread of its own !

 

[didds]

you keep it simple.
Own 22, midfield, oppo 22.

pop and flop (from scrum etc)
kick long and smother
own PK - lineout front ball, - then back to pop and flop.


thats about it really

 

[shebeen]

Foley didn't hear the referee? My fat fucking arse he didn't.

As I said, there is a great picture of one his treammates -Leota? - behind him, and further away from the referee, who was not talking in his direction. Leota clearly knows what has happened because he is giving Foley the hurry up in no uncertain terms.

Foley, as I said, gambled, and his forwards screwed him. It was horrible game management from Gold, with zero contextual awareness. The right answer was to ckick the ball in to row ZZ, and walk very slowly to the lineout. Let the clock expire there, flat throw to pod 1, straight to 9 who kicks it out. If Gold don't have that play in their toolkit, that's just shabby.

I don't agree here, his first reaction is genuinely that he thought time was off.

Some more footage of the incident without replays, and the chit chat with ref afterwards

With the penalty given 90 seconds before the end of play, the final move will be a lineout with Aus throw in.
Foley can kick it after 5 seconds, or 55 or 155 and the previous stanza in italics remains the same. There is no way to avoid having to throw the ball in again.

Quite a time to make this call, and once again the post match talk is all about a ref call.

 

[Ciaran Trainor]

The instuction from the ref on time on and time of are clear so no excuse for ignoring them.
The problem is he and others choose to ignore blatant time wasting in this and all other top flight games. He should not have been pedantic with this one incident.
Let's hope moving forward they crack down IAW the laws.
Including
1. take penalty kicks from the mark not 5 paces further forward or in field.
2. speed up all this huddle nonsense before lineouts. Could even let the timekeeper handle Time off/Time on for ball in play at top level
3. speed up formation of a scrum and time off first time one goes down until ball emerges from subsequent. Again timekeeper could do this.
4 enforce 5 seconds at caterpillar rucks as soon as ball is available.
5. enforce time allowed for penalties and conversions. again could be left with timekeeper.

To be fair he had the balls to stick around and explain after full time but I didn't like his pointing body language.

 

[Marc Wakeham]

With the penalty given 90 seconds before the end of play, the final move will be a lineout with Aus throw in.
Foley can kick it after 5 seconds, or 55 or 155 and the previous stanza in italics remains the same. There is no way to avoid having to throw the ball in again.

Not so. If the penalty is tapped and then kicked off the pitch. End of the game. If time is up when it goes into touch.

 

[BikingBud]

Again absolutely clear. Poor game management cost the game, not the final 2 mins.

Referee was very clear and @shebeen Foley even acknowledges the ref's instructions!

When one of your panel of experts say "A debacle! .....We were scratching our heads, did you know the was a thing" "rules!" the credibility is sprinting out of the door.

Nothing new there, just a few more people that feel unjustly treated and aggrieved.

 

[BikingBud]

Not so. If the penalty is tapped and then kicked off the pitch. End of the game. If time is up when it goes into touch.

Or they tap and then kick into touch before time is up and its NZ throw, NZ win the ball and score.

Or direct kick and Aus execute the lineout poorly, NZ collect the loose ball drive a series of "moves" or phases leading to a try under the posts.

Or kick gets shanked and the AB winger catches and counters leading to a score.

Or many other options or further phases providing there is not a stoppage.

NZ had possession from the scrum, Aus defence was poor and were already on a penalty advantage when NZ scored. Did the ref award that arbitrarily or was it a good score?

 

[Dickie E]

the galling thing for me was that the French ref waited til Foley commenced his run up to take the kick before making his 'gotcha' call.

Like the ref who tells a player to take a step, the player does so, then the ref pings him for offside.

Or the ref who tells a tackler to release & roll away, the player complies, then the ref penalises him.

 

[SimonSmith]

I have no way of knowing if thsi is true. But if it is, the problem is Foley

 

[didds]

what were Aus' lineout stats for front ball on their own throw all game ?

 

[Marc Wakeham]

the galling thing for me was that the French ref waited til Foley commenced his run up to take the kick before making his 'gotcha' call.

Like the ref who tells a player to take a step, the player does so, then the ref pings him for offside.

Or the ref who tells a tackler to release & roll away, the player complies, then the ref penalises him.

I think it is different to the other cases you cite. He warned him checked his watch and blew. I posted early suggesting he might have chosen a different approach but the details comming out put the blme firmly on the player. Even teammates are shouting at him to shift.

 

[Ian_Cook]

In addition to those times given by Mark Stafford (posted by Simon) , Foley was also told to get on with it....
- at 08:45 for delaying the 22DO after Jordie Barrett's attempt at goal.
- at 36:27 for delaying the GLDO after Taukei'aho's disallowed try.

So, warned or told to get on with the game no less than three times earlier in the match, then warned again twice in the 79th minute before the scrum was awarded.

I wonder how many times Foley thinks he is entitled to be warned about his delaying of the game before the referee takes action?

 

[chbg]

the galling thing for me was that the French ref waited til Foley commenced his run up to take the kick before making his 'gotcha' call.

Like the ref who tells a player to take a step, the player does so, then the ref pings him for offside.

Or the ref who tells a tackler to release & roll away, the player complies, then the ref penalises him.

That's only a function of 'decision taken to penalise' and 'time taken to put whistle to lips'.

Like the ref whose whistle for a knock-on is heard after the players' appeals.