[Line out] How do you resume the game for ball not going 5m?

Rich_NL

Rich_NL

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It used to be a FK. The lawbook changed this - unnanounced - to options(/choice), but the example film shows a FK being given. It's a mess.
 
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ChuckieB

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The ball must:

  • Reach the five-metre line before it hits the ground or is played.[COLOR=#2A3D83 !important]Sanction: [/COLOR][COLOR=#2A3D83 !important]Option of lineout or scrum. If the lineout is chosen and the ball is again not thrown straight, a scrum is awarded to the team that originally threw in the ball.[/COLOR]
 
beckett50

beckett50


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Option call:

Either
a) Scrum to the non-offending team on the 15m line, or
b) Line out again, with the non-offending team throwing in the ball.

However, if this line out is not straight then the sanction is a scrum (there is no option)
 
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Marc Wakeham


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Level dependent.

(Very) Low levels: "Ok lads lets go again."

Above you have to apply the law book Scrum or throw in to a new line out. as per:

2017
[LAWS]19.7 INCORRECT THROW-IN
(a) If the throw-in at a lineout is incorrect , the opposing team has the choice of throwing in at a
lineout or a scrum on the 15-metre line. If they choose the throw-in to the lineout and it is
again incorrect , a scrum is formed. The team that took the first throw-in throws in the ball.[/LAWS]

2019
23. The ball must :
a. Be thrown in straight along the mark of touch;

and
b. Reach the fivemetre line before it hits the ground or is played.

Sanction: Option of lineout or scrum. If the lineout is chosen and the ball is again not thrown
straight, a scrum is awarded to the team that originally threw in the ball.
c. Be thrown in without delay once the lineout is formed. Sanction:
Click to expand...


So no change there then
 
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ChuckieB

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Hard to say the ref might not have awarded a free kick for what he might have viewed as a delay in the throw, or entering and recovering in the 5m channel (always though the laws are a bit vague on the element), rather than a error in the throw from the viewing angle he had.

Without additional info you shouldn't be 100% confident to suggest an error on his part.

Unlikely perhaps, but we'll never know.
 
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Taff


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cccref said:
How would you resume the game?
Click to expand...
I have found that the best way of working it out is to ask yourself "Why didn't the ball travel the minimum 5m?"

  • If the Thrower messed it up - it's a LO / Scrum option.
  • If a player in the LO messed it up (eg running into the 5m channel before the ball had gone 5m) - it's a FK.
In your video, the Hooker messed up (so strictly speaking it should be LO / Scrum option) but depending on the tone of the game, age etc as Wakeham hinted I must admit I may be tempted to ask him to throw it again.
 
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OB..


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ChuckieB said:
The ball must:

  • Reach the five-metre line before it hits the ground or is played.[COLOR=#2A3D83 !important]Sanction: [/COLOR][COLOR=#2A3D83 !important]Option of lineout or scrum. If the lineout is chosen and the ball is again not thrown straight, a scrum is awarded to the team that originally threw in the ball.[/COLOR]
Click to expand...
Badly drafted?

If not 5 and then (lineout chosen) not straight, it cannot be "again not thrown straight". They presumable meant scrum if either infringement occurs on the second lineout.
 
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ChuckieB

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OB.. said:
Badly drafted?

If not 5 and then (lineout chosen) not straight, it cannot be "again not thrown straight". They presumable meant scrum if either infringement occurs on the second lineout.
Click to expand...

Bad drafting? Surely not!

At least we do know what they mean on this one. Or Perhaps not?
 
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Camquin

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OB, you are not saying that the Law book, the sanctum of all that is holy within the game, is badly drafted.
Surely after all the times the committee has spent on it it should be perfect.

But I forget it is a IRB committee, they were probably on the gin.
I suppose we should be grateful it does not have a sweary rant about their ex-girlfriends.
 
Phil E

Phil E


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2 becasue it wasn't prevented from going 5 (FK) it just failed to go 5...so options.
 
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Martin Doughty

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(Fortunately) this happens so rarely that it has made us all think !!
As many others have said, the correct decision would be to award the non-offending side the Scrum/Line-Out option.

But, I actually had this happen about 18 months ago in a low-level Colts game.
I saw players move uncertainly towards the ball as the thrower re-caught his own throw... but I could see that very soon someone would come flying in at speed and tackle an un-prepared player.
So I blew quickly, made a joke of it and told them that we would do it all again... {As Marc suggests in post #5}. And everyone saw the funny side and accepted the decision.
 
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crossref


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Martin Doughty said:
So I blew quickly, made a joke of it and told them that we would do it all again... {As Marc suggests in post #5}. And everyone saw the funny side and accepted the decision.
Click to expand...

of course, had you offered options, everyone would have accepted that as well.

Did you allow them to take it again because you were uncertain of the Law - or did you know the correct decision but decided to do something else?

If the former, fair enough, it's an unusual one, no harm done -but if the latter, why would you do that?
 
Dickie E

Dickie E


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if the non-throwing team had picked up the ball and played on, is this an advantage situation?
 
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crossref


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Dickie E said:
it's an empathy thing. If a player attempts to kick off but it ends up as a fresh air swing, what do you do?
Click to expand...

in that instance there is no offence committed, he has to kick off


a better parallel is that he attempts completely miskicks it, and the ball travels 1m.

It's an easy one : Not 10 - options, scrum or kick again.


a big part of empathy is that where the Laws are straightforward the players are trusting you to follow the Laws....
 
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