90-Degree Turnover: New Scrum or Same Scrum?

[Bryan]

The below-quoted text can be found on the SA Refs Duty Ref Area.

2. Name: Jack
Question: Hi there, I was wondering what the official interpretation is when a scrum turnover happens after the 80 minutes are up? I've seen it ruled two different ways this season in the Super 15. (Highlanders vs Crusaders and Force vs Waratahs if I remember correctly).
Cheers
Stu Berry: Hi Jack. It’s an interesting one, and you are spot on. A scrum that collapses and gets reset is the same scrum, and so is incomplete. A scrum that is a turnover through 90 degrees is a new scrum, and so time needs to be called once the turnover has been completed.

One for the designated members, perhaps? The above bolded text is NOT how I would expect it to be refereed, so I'm wondering if this is in fact a new application of law, or whether I'm simply old hat.

KML, this could be your vindication!

 

[Ian_Cook]

I would like to see Stu justify that in Law, because turning through 90 degrees is not one of the ways that a scrum ends successfully on Law 20.10

The 90° wheeled scrum used to result in the same team feeding until 2000 when the turnover was introduced as an ELV. It remained an ELV until incorporated in 2009.

 

[Phil E]

He probably justifies it because the law says:

[LAWS]This new scrum is formed at the place where the previous scrum ended[/LAWS]

http://www.rugbyrefs.com/showthread.php?14632-Scrum-wheel-full-time&p=203013&highlight=#post203013

 

[Ian_Cook]

But

[LAWS]20.4 THE TEAM THROWING THE BALL INTO THE SCRUM

(e) When a scrum remains stationary and the ball does not emerge immediately a further scrum is ordered at the place of the stoppage. The ball is thrown in by the team not in possession at the time of the stoppage.

(f) When a scrum becomes stationary and does not start moving immediately, the ball must emerge immediately. If it does not a further scrum will be ordered. The ball is thrown in by the team not in possession at the time of the stoppage.

(g) If a scrum collapses or lifts up into the air without sanction a further scrum will be ordered and the team who originally threw in the ball will throw the ball in again.[/LAWS]

The game cannot end om any of these occasions.

I am uncomfortable with the idea that a team can end a match by wheeling a scrum.

 

[OB..]

I am sure (as far as I can be with my memory) that in a match that Chris White refereed he had the match continue after a wheeled scrum with time expired.

 

[Mike Whittaker]

To my mind it is just another reset. Nobody has infringed and no sanction has been applied - just a turnover of the ball for the reformed scrum. No way the game is ended.

 

[ChrisR]

Can the match end on a FK?

 

[ckuxmann]

Can the match end on a FK?

No, a FK is essentially a PK it's an infringement that "extends" time.