Clarifying line-out laws?

[Stu10]

I've been reading through law 18 and I'm left scratching my head over a few aspects.

First, is the receiver and the hooker part of the line-out?

Law 18.17.a
Once the lineout is formed, players:
From the team throwing in may not leave the lineout other than to change positions with other participating players.

Depending on the answer to my first question, can a receiver swap position with a player in the line?

Laws 18.27 and 18.28

1. Once the lineout has commenced, the thrower and the thrower’s immediate opponent may:
   1. Join the lineout.
   2. Retire to the offside line of the non-participating players of his own team.
   3. Stay within five metres of the touchline.
   4. Move to the receiver position if that position is empty.
2. If those players move anywhere else, they are offside. Sanction: Penalty.

How does the hooker "join the lineout"? What does this look like? Does it mean join a maul or ruck formed at a lineout before the lineout is considered to have ended? Does this help answer my early question, "is the hooker part of the line-out"?

(Assuming there is a receiver) If the hooker decides not to join the maul/ruck and takes up a lateral position (to defend or receive a pop, depending if in possession), can he position himself on the side of the maul/ruck furthest from the touchline? I assume not, because he must "Stay within five metres of the touchline" (18.27.3). I assume the alternative is to fall back to the 10m offside line (18.27.2)? However, the offside line for other players in the lineout is the backfoot of the maul/ruck (18.33.b).

Can a hooker peel around for a pop, leaving the 5m channel, when there is already a scrumhalf in the receiver position?

Law 18.16
If a team elects to have a receiver, the receiver stands between the five-metre and the 15-metre lines, two metres away from their team-mates in the lineout. Each team may have only one receiver.

Law 18.38
Other than by moving to the receiver position if that position is empty, no lineout player may leave the lineout until it has ended.

Law 18.29.d
Once the lineout has commenced, any player in the lineout may:
Leave the lineout so as to be in a position to receive the ball, provided they remain within 10 metres of the mark of touch and they keep moving until the lineout is over. Sanction: Free-kick.

Is there alignment between laws 18.16, 18.29.d and 18.38? We often see a player peel around when there is a scrum-half in the receiver position, and occasionally we even see 2 players move into a position to receive the ball (though in reality they are getting into a better position to form a driving maul).

Law 18.36
Once the ball has been thrown in by a team-mate, players who are not participating in the lineout may move forward. If that occurs, then their opponents may also move forward. If the ball does not go beyond the 15-metre line, the players will not be liable to sanction if they immediately retire to their respective offside lines.

I assumed this law's sole purpose is to enable the long >15m throw to someone running on from a flyhalf position.

If a player (lets say flyhalf) moves forward expecting a long throw over the top, but then someone in the line-out actually catches the ball, but the the ball is quickly transferred to the scrumhalf and passed out before the flyhalf has retired to the 10m offside line, is the flyhalf offside? An experienced ref in our Society told me that he would allow the attacking backs to come forward once the ball has been thrown in irrelevant of whether it was thrown with the intent to go >15m.

I'll admit, I'm really picking through the details here, and I suspect some of these aspects are "ignored" and effectively dealt with by game management, but I feel I may yet learn something and become a better ref by clarifying my understanding of these laws and how best to manage them.

 

[Volun-selected]

(I guess another question could have been does it need to be the hooker? Obviously we always see the forwards in the lineout but technically isn’t it just X number of players from team A vs. (generally) X number of players from team B?)

Given 18.27 has they join the lineout, then to me they are not already part of the lineout - but are participants so not offside. To join the lineout then they either go into the same space as the lineout players (so into the ruck), or the receiver position, or retire offside.

As for the pop around the back, or even when the ball is caught in the lineout and passed straight back to the hooker still with 5m or the touchline - then as the ball has left the lineout (or is now in the touchline-5m area) then the lineout has technically ended before the thrower has joined so play on?

Probably kinda helps this all happens really quickly.

If a player (lets say flyhalf) moves forward expecting a long throw over the top, but then someone in the line-out actually catches the ball, but the the ball is quickly transferred to the scrumhalf and passed out before the flyhalf has retired to the 10m offside line, is the flyhalf offside? An experienced ref in our Society told me that he would allow the attacking backs to come forward once the ball has been thrown in irrelevant of whether it was thrown with the intent to go >15m.

I think I’d ping this. I’m ok with the initial movement as it’s specifically called out - but it also has:

If the ball does not go beyond the 15-metre line, the players will not be liable to sanction if they immediately retire to their respective offside lines.

My emphasis, but if the ball doesn’t immediately go past 15m - either an overthrow or off the hand of a jumper - then to me the fly half is offside.

 

[chbg]

Include the Definitions, particularly for this Law:

Lineout players: The players in either line of a lineout.
Participating players at a lineout: These consist of lineout players, one receiver from each team (if present), the player who throws in and an immediate opponent.

So yes, Law 18.17a includes them. Not necessarily the hooker who throws in.

The lineout continues until (Law 18.37}, including until the feet of all maul/ruck (as if!) participants have crossed the line of touch. So such a maul/ruck is still a lineout phase. The thrower can set himself on any part of the offside line. OR he stays inside the 5m zone. There is no MUST stay within 5m - it is merely an option.

A 'pop receiver' keeps moving. No requirement for a Receiver to do so. The Receiver should (invariably not policed) stay at 2m from lineout players; the 'pop receiver' doesn't have to.

Being offside doesn't mean that someone has to be penalised; he is given time to reset. However both sets of backs should stay somewhere near the 10m offisde line until the lineout is over. I suspect that there was a nuance to the experienced referee allowing the backs to come up - 1-2m when the lineout is over quickly not a problem; 8-9m whilst the lineout phase is still going, not good.

 

[Stu10]

Include the Definitions, particularly for this Law:

Lineout players: The players in either line of a lineout.
Participating players at a lineout: These consist of lineout players, one receiver from each team (if present), the player who throws in and an immediate opponent.

So yes, Law 18.17a includes them. Not necessarily the hooker who throws in.

The lineout continues until (Law 18.37}, including until the feet of all maul/ruck (as if!) participants have crossed the line of touch. So such a maul/ruck is still a lineout phase. The thrower can set himself on any part of the offside line. OR he stays inside the 5m zone. There is no MUST stay within 5m - it is merely an option.

A 'pop receiver' keeps moving. No requirement for a Receiver to do so. The Receiver should (invariably not policed) stay at 2m from lineout players; the 'pop receiver' doesn't have to.

Being offside doesn't mean that someone has to be penalised; he is given time to reset. However both sets of backs should stay somewhere near the 10m offisde line until the lineout is over. I suspect that there was a nuance to the experienced referee allowing the backs to come up - 1-2m when the lineout is over quickly not a problem; 8-9m whilst the lineout phase is still going, not good.

I didn't think to check the definitions - thanks!

"The thrower can set himself on any part of the offside line" - is that the back foot of the ruck/maul, or 10m back from the lineout?

"pop receiver" - being in a position to receive the ball is not the same as being the receiver... correct?

 

[chbg]

I didn't think to check the definitions - thanks!

"The thrower can set himself on any part of the offside line" - is that the back foot of the ruck/maul, or 10m back from the lineout?

"pop receiver" - being in a position to receive the ball is not the same as being the receiver... correct?

A lineout player's offside line.

Correct, otherwise possibly known as a peeler. Law 18.29d

 

[Stu10]

A lineout player's offside line.

Does that align with Law 18.27.b?

 

[chbg]

Does that align with Law 18.27.b?

That's the beauty of options - you can do one or the other.