Pegleg
Rugby Expert
- Joined
- Sep 3, 2014
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- Current Referee grade:
- Level 3
I'm reading of people moaning about the refs discussing the problem players because they will ref them with bias.
I'm reading of people moaning about the refs discussing the problem players because they will ref them with bias.
If the scrum is moving, a straight feed is impossible. An essential pre-requisite was to remove the hit, which has now more or less been achieved. However the players are still trying to get some kind of advantage at the Set. I don't see how a straight feed in itself would stop this.I tend to agree with BCM's stated position which is that if you root cause the issue, then ensuring a straight put in would solve the vast majority of the problems.
It is not a simple either/or. It is a fact that the moment of the feed is exactly the moment when the shove comes on and problems are likely to arise.However, the usual disclaimer from Elite referees is that there is too much other stuff going on to prioritize the put in. That conveniently ignores the idea that if you DID prioritize the put in, that multitude of things they have to look for would diminish.
At my levels we certainly do not get the same power and technique being applied. The greater the power the greater the likelihood that the resultant forces will find a weakness, aided, of course, but whatever dark arts are being employed.Anecdotal evidence: I bet we all ensure a straight put in. I also bet that we have far fewer scrum incidents. Now, correlation isn't causation, but it's a strong datum point.
If you ensure a straight feed, does the need to win an advantage at the set still exist to the same degree? I think a lot of unrest comes from the fact that the defensive scrum knows it has no chance of winning anything and so sets out to disrupt; the offence then has to counteract that, and then we're into a negative spiral.If the scrum is moving, a straight feed is impossible. An essential pre-requisite was to remove the hit, which has now more or less been achieved. However the players are still trying to get some kind of advantage at the Set. I don't see how a straight feed in itself would stop this.
At the Elite level, they can make better use of the ARs to helpIt is not a simple either/or. It is a fact that the moment of the feed is exactly the moment when the shove comes on and problems are likely to arise.
Amen to that.You make good points. But I think this problem never gets cracked until all the responsible parties admit it and change. And that has to include the referees.
Isnt this Catch 22 pegleg ....... if known problem (elite) players aren't identified (discussed) , then each referee has to find out during each scrum at each match and doing this takes effort ,time and escalation management and resets etc ..... Which are some of the issues the top matches are being criticised for.
So, the alternative is what?
I had a level 5 game yesterday shit load of scrums and the weather was horrendous.
2 PKs for standing up
and 1 reset the whole game.
The rest of the time they completed. Because the players wanted to scrummage.
I had a level 5 game yesterday shit load of scrums and the weather was horrendous.
2 PKs for standing up
and 1 reset the whole game.
The rest of the time they completed. Because the players wanted to scrummage.
Law reference for the "Standing up" offence Andy ?
Really..... not a single unstraight feed???? Nor any binding PKs????
Did you referee vicars v brown owls? :biggrin: