Scrum back or 22 Drop Out ??

[RUGBYBOOT]

Hi - Watched a game last week - attacking side kicked the ball into the defending sides in goal area - whilst the ball was still moving the defending winger placed one foot over dead ball line and applied 'downward pressure' on the ball, clearly expecting the ref to offer a scrum back at the place the ball was kicked.

However, the ref said that it was a 22 drop out as the player did not pick up and place the ball, stating that had he done so then the defending side would be offered the option of a scrum back but because only downward pressure was applied it was a 22 drop out ??

Thoughts please ?? Cheers

 

[dave_clark]

off the top of my head i'd say correct decision. similar to being able to press on the ball to score a try when your feet are in touch.

 

[dave_clark]

poor use of the phrase "downward pressure" though, which only appears in the laws under scrummaging.

 

[Adam]

From what I remember is if you pick the moving ball up with one foot over the dead ball line then the ball has in effect crossed the dead ball line and it would be a scrum back.

As he touched the ball down, then his foot is irrelevant so 22m drop out.

 

[RUGBYBOOT]

off the top of my head i'd say correct decision. similar to being able to press on the ball to score a try when your feet are in touch.

Sorry, are you saying then that the ball must be picked up and placed down in order to be offered the option of scrum back or not ??

 

[RUGBYBOOT]

From what I remember is if you pick the moving ball up with one foot over the dead ball line then the ball has in effect crossed the dead ball line and it would be a scrum back.

As he touched the ball down, then his foot is irrelevant so 22m drop out.

I agree with you - although don't take that as meaning its right !

 

[dave_clark]

Sorry, are you saying then that the ball must be picked up and placed down in order to be offered the option of scrum back or not ??

nope, just picked up.

 

[Deeps]

I am with AJ. The touch down is irrelevant. As soon as the defender with one foot over the DBL touched the moving ball, the ball had gone dead from the kick. Options apply.

 

[ddjamo]

I am with AJ. The touch down is irrelevant. As soon as the defender with one foot over the DBL touched the moving ball, the ball had gone dead from the kick. Options apply.

law states "picked up." can you back that up in law? 22.9(e)

 

[nobackchat]

Picked up is key. Laws are pretty straight forward. Analogous (but inverted) is Law 22.4.g where an attacking player can be in-touch or touch-in-goal and ground the ball which is in goal and score a try.

 

[The Fat]

I am with AJ. The touch down is irrelevant. As soon as the defender with one foot over the DBL touched the moving ball, the ball had gone dead from the kick. Options apply.

I don't think that is what AJ is saying.

Quote:
"From what I remember is if you pick the moving ball up with one foot over the dead ball line then the ball has in effect crossed the dead ball line and it would be a scrum back.
As he touched the ball down, then his foot is irrelevant so 22m drop out".

The correct decision from the OP is 22 drop out. Attacking side kick into defender's 22 and defender makes a touch down to make the ball dead in in-goal. 22 drop out.
Had the defender, with foot over the DBL, picked up the moving ball, then the kicker has made the ball dead and scrum option is offered.

 

[Adam]

I don't think that is what AJ is saying.

Quote:
"From what I remember is if you pick the moving ball up with one foot over the dead ball line then the ball has in effect crossed the dead ball line and it would be a scrum back.
As he touched the ball down, then his foot is irrelevant so 22m drop out".

The correct decision from the OP is 22 drop out. Attacking side kick into defender's 22 and defender makes a touch down to make the ball dead in in-goal. 22 drop out.
Had the defender, with foot over the DBL, picked up the moving ball, then the kicker has made the ball dead and scrum option is offered.

This was what I was saying, but I was so surprised to see someone agreeing with me that I didn't argue! Doesn't often happen!

 

[Deeps]

Thanks guys, I stand corrected. :Zip:

 

[ddjamo]

Thanks guys, I stand corrected. :Zip:

np deeps...was just making sure I didn't miss anything.

 

[RUGBYBOOT]

Cheers everyone - cleared it up for me - comes down to poor understanding by the player concerned - should have picked up the moving ball and not grounded it if he wanted the option of a scrum back ( if I have understood it right !! ) - Thanks Gary