Trouble at maul

[Browner]

But there's moving, and there's moving.

Of course, but my main point is, If its not C&O moving forwards, then its stopped. Thereafter "maul stopped" Law is better, rather than ball unplayable, as "use it" puts everyone on notice of the scrum outcome to follow.

Its a better management communication, for me anyway.

 

[Pegleg]

a bit of common sense is required.

Eurika!

 

[Not Kurt Weaver]

"Captain, we have spoken this, FK for unsportsmanlike behaviour and the next time it will be a PK. Are we understanding each other?"

Were they taking the mickey?

No need to penalise, just tell them it's the same answer as before so no need to ask anymore. It's the same as at a penalty when I'm repeatedly asked if they are 10. After the first couple of times I tell them 'Yes, now you know what 10m looks like, remember it. If unsure, take two steps back."

FK and PK I think is an over-reaction.

If there is persistant "asking" (really they are telling you that they deserve the T/O) then go through the FK / PK route. Was it too early on the third time? Well that depends on the general nature of the game. was theree a lot of appealing generally: "Not straight ref!" , "Watch the hooker's foot ref!", "Can you watch the Offsides ref!?". If it was just the maul I guess I'd hold back on the FK. If they were "moaners" then the FK would be earlier.

Only you can tell if it was right to escalate so soon. - You were there!

Good point made in one of the replies. If that ball is not going to emerge blow early. Why waste time?

Early in thread several mentioned a FK

Wot FK? not an option here is it?

 

[Pegleg]

Indeed. I did not think about the sanction I was just replying about the principle of escalation and missed that. My bad.

 

[Pegleg]

BUCs SF on Wednesday. I blew for about half a dozen (stil in motion) unplayables. Both coaches thanked me for my handling of the game.

Explain your call clearly and the players generally understand.

 

[Browner]

I blew for about half a dozen (stil in motion) unplayables.
Both coaches thanked me for my handling of the game.
.

Expected coach thanking of the referee by BUCS isnt the acid test on law application or game management per se, but its nice to hear, and I'm sure you are a skilled referee ( otherwise you wouldn't get such a fixture) .

If you take the view that a maul "still in motion" is unplayable then that's of course your choice ( and 'unplayable' does indeed give wide subjective authority to a referee to decide on such matters , so much so that players might not be able to accurately predict when it might occur)

I prefer to give the players warning of the pending decision by indicating the maul has stopped ( which might mean not moving enough, or virtually stopped) and then calling "use it" as the triggering of a 5 secs warning then does four things;

1) it energises the team who took the ball into contact's effort to get the ball out and keep the game going ( yes it sometimes does emerge)

2) it's a safety net for me in case the team in possession are actually keeping the ball in the maul deliberately, they can now extricate it at their leisure unable to frustratedly claim that they were 'just about to' extricate it

3) it gives players clear notice of the scrum award in 5s time, which IMO is better for them than getting no prior notice when the referee suddenly whistles unplayable.

4) it dissuades defenders appealing for "their turnover" from their "choking" within only 4 secs of it occurring !

If your maul management works for you pegleg, then carry on by all means, mine works for me, (and is offered as a suggestion to other readers) and is within my preventative call suite, as it often prevents unplayables , prevents frustrations, and prevents scrum restarts.

Cheers

PS....Im hoping you do us a favour & bring the Taff 'A' game out to play this weekend, its been a while since we've seen it .

 

[Pegleg]

I advise the players to "protect their ball" and that if it's not emerging then an unplayable is on the cards.

The point is, of course, an ball that is not going to emerge IS unplayable and there is legal justification in calling a halt. IT's a management tool / option anf too be used wih the same care as the rest of the book. To be blinkered, on either side of the debate, is a dangerous and dare I say foolish, position to be in.

WRT to tomorrow. I don't care. Ireland are playing the best rugby of the NH, granted on the little I've watched this season. So I think I'd rather they win the Championship.

 

[Browner]

I advise the players to "protect their ball" and that if it's not emerging then an unplayable is on the cards.
.

I'm curious Pegleg, as to how you communicate this during game play , ie.... The extent of your dialogue with players, to make it clear which stage of deciding you are currently at ..... Is this before ( briefing?) or during each maul ?

 

[Pegleg]

First maul.