[Law] Yellow card then uncontested Scrums and knowing the league rules

[Ciaran Trainor]

Question at my club last week.league game level 7
First match of the season they were playing at Team A who had a man in the bin for technical offence.
While he was off, a prop went down and FR replacement had already happened so scrums had to go uncontested.
Club coach thought they should have gone down to 13 as if they were at full strength and went to uncontested it would definitely be down to 14.
Home team insisted that wasn't the case and played with 14 referee agreed
My club won the game so didn't complain and them A got a bonus point for finishing inside 7.
ironically team A are 1 point behind my club and they have one game left and if they get a bonus point they stay up and my club get relegated much inferior points difference but apparently it's number of wins that count
Too late to complain now.
So am I right, they should have gone down to 13.

In the same league another team A* have had 3 points deducted for not taking a man off in a similar scenario but team B knew the rules and complained. This has cost A* a playoff place and team B have replaced them.
Apparently the organising committee decided that it is not up to the ref to know the rules of the competition.

The league could end up with 4 teams on 46 points and despite my club having the best points difference, over 300 more than one club they could still get relegated as its number of wins that count first.
Nobody knew this til the calculators came out towards the end of the season.

Moral of the story make sure you know the rules if you're a club. Us refs don't need to:wtf:

 

[Pegleg]

Apparently the organising committee decided that it is not up to the ref to know the rules of the competition.

Tosh. The ref has to know the law variations applicable to the game he is refereeing. The tournament rules, such as what happens if the game is drawn in terms of who goes through etc is not the refs concern. He must know if Extra time is allowed and if PKs are taken after ET. But what happens then is not his concern. During the game? Of corse he should know.

 

[chbg]

The referee should know the match Regulations, but may well be refereeing to a different set each weekend. He is also the sole judge of only fact and Law. Therefore a decision made during a match based on the Regulations, rather than on Law, is not necessarily binding on the Organising Committee.

A Coach fails his team/club if he does not (a) know the Competition Regulations and (b) have a hard/electronic copy to hand.

 

[Pegleg]

Law variations ARE law. The referee must know then to judge fact.

 

[chbg]

But 'man-off' and substitute applications normally fall under country/county Competition Regulations, which are not Law Variations.

 

[OB..]

Law variations ARE law. The referee must know then to judge fact.

Law variations and local regulations are not the same thing. Law 3 allows some measure of local autonomy eg in Gloucestershire Leagues we do not apply the "man-off" rule for uncontested scrums. Ever since I nearly got caught out with that, we have made a point of ensuring exchange referees are made aware of this.

 

[Pegleg]

We are expected to know anything that is applicable to the condut of the game for the 80 + minutes. It is considered, effectively, as part of the laws. Tie breaks etc are for the comp regs not us. We report the score whether or not there were uncontested scrums etc and it is over to the organisers to interpret the regs. Anything relating to numbers on the field / cards / subs etc is MY responsibility as a ref and I am marked down if I get them wrong. As far as we are concerned it is part of the management of the game.

That said we only apply the man off ruling as covered in law 3 where 23 players are in a squad so it would never apply to me.

Our only competition variations concern substitutes/ replacements where it is often the case that subs are allowed even if we start with uncontested scrums (up to second team level). Referees are expected to be fully aware of the rule which stems from the WRU. It is treated, for the referee, as a law variation. It is OUR referee's duty to know and apply any such variation.

Basically anything the referee must know in order to carry out his job correctly is his rrsponsibility. The prospect of a referee allowing a team an extra player because he does not know a variation is unacceptable. This applies even if he hides behind the semantics of Competition rule versus Law.