Abusive language and restart

[Chogan]

Red score a try in the corner and as the bodies are getting to their feet well after the try had been awarded a red player arrives (he had not been on the ground) and yells at a blue player still on the floor.

"You ginger prick you ****ing ****"

I call the player over with a "you" and a pointed finger.
"That behavior is completely unacceptable and will not be tolerated. You're going to the bin."
I issue the card :noyc:, the conversion is then attempted and I restart with a penalty on the half way line.

Does anyone have an issue with this.
This was a schoolboy U19 match.

 

[Ian_Cook]

Red score a try in the corner and as the bodies are getting to their feet well after the try had been awarded a red player arrives (he had not been on the ground) and yells at a blue player still on the floor.

"You ginger prick you ****ing ****"

I call the player over with a "you" and a pointed finger.
"That behavior is completely unacceptable and will not be tolerated. You're going to the bin."
I issue the card :noyc:, the conversion is then attempted and I restart with a penalty on the half way line.

Does anyone have an issue with this.
This was a schoolboy U19 match.

Textbook!

 

[menace]

I typically warn U18 in my brief that I won't tolerate swearing...so because of that prior warning, for me this would have been :norc:

 

[Dickie E]

I restart with a penalty on the half way line.

Does anyone have an issue with this.

Depends on who you gave the penalty to.

 

[TigerCraig]

Only thing I would do differently is call out the captain as well and talk to him, not the player:

"That behavior is completely unacceptable and will not be tolerated. He is going to the bin. We will be restarting with a penalty to blue. Talk to your players and tell them no more"

Would probably also call over blue captain and say something like "the mater has been dealt with. Please talk to your players. I don't want any more"

(to menace's point, at juniors depending on what the ***** was, itcould be red)

 

[menace]

(to menace's point, at juniors depending on what the ***** was, itcould be red)

**** and ****** is ok, but ***** is not! :biggrin:. The five letter words are always the bad ones.

 

[Taff]

I typically warn U18 in my brief that I won't tolerate swearing...so because of that prior warning, for me this would have been :norc:

Seriously?

I've seen PKs given for swearing, but I don't think I've seen a :noyc: and I'm pretty sure I have never seen a :norc:

 

[Stuartg]

Well done for not tolerating this abusive language. You did the right thing.

 

[menace]

Seriously?

I've seen PKs given for swearing, but I don't think I've seen a :noyc: and I'm pretty sure I have never seen a :norc:

Yep..absolutely. If it's loud enough and bad enough I will. My 8year old son is often at the ground with me, and he doesn't need to hear some snotty nose 'cool' 17 year old or below call someone a 'f@cking c@nt!'. Neither do the mums and grandmas need to hear it. Having said that, I've never had to do it. Usually it stops after the first PK when they know I'm serious.

'Abusing' someone is not in the spirit of the game, and at that age it is antagonistic and will lead to a flashpoint if you let it continue.

Call me a jobsworth...but it's just not necessary on the field at that age.

 

[Ian_Cook]

Yep..absolutely. If it's loud enough and bad enough I will. My 8year old son is often at the ground with me, and he doesn't need to hear some snotty nose 'cool' 17 year old or below call someone a 'f@cking c@nt!'. Neither do the mums and grandmas need to hear it. Having said that, I've never had to do it. Usually it stops after the first PK when they know I'm serious.

'Abusing' someone is not in the spirit of the game, and at that age it is antagonistic and will lead to a flashpoint if you let it continue.

Call me a jobsworth...but it's just not necessary on the field at that age.

I agree menace. That kind of language is an absolute minimum :noyc:, and if directed at another player with anger, then :norc:

Get in now, when they're young and hit them hard.

 

[The Fat]

Well done Chogan.
As TigerCraig said, I would also talk to the captain rather than the player.

Taff,
In Juniors, I also tell them at the pre-match brief that swearing will not be tollerated.
I have issued a couple of YCs for swearing but not a red. If a player had been yellow carded for swearing and then did it again later in the game, I wouldn't hesitate to give his a 2nd and therefore a red.
If a player swears at himself for something he has done and it is not too loud, I'll just have a word with him or his captain on the run. But if it is loud and directed at others, it's probably going to be a PK or a yellow.

 

[winchesterref]

I also would possibly not have used a pointed finger? We get advised to use a hand instead.

 

[Dixie]

Seriously?

I've seen PKs given for swearing, but I don't think I've seen a :noyc: and I'm pretty sure I have never seen a :norc:

I agree menace. That kind of language is an absolute minimum :noyc:, and if directed at another player with anger, then :norc:

Get in now, when they're young and hit them hard.

I agree with these two, though perhaps would hesitate to go straight to red. Swearing is relatively benign - "spin the fu**ing ball out!" - while what was said here was as deliberate verbal assault, designed to rile and provoke a reaction. If the miscreant had achieved his assault without resort to Anglo-Saxon language, I'd still have YC'd him - it's not the language that is offensive here, it's the intent and the disrespect of the opponent, contrary to rugby's core values:

It is through discipline, control and mutual respect that the Spirit of
the Game flourishes and, in the context of a Game as physically
challenging as Rugby, these are the qualities which forge the
fellowship and sense of fair play so essential to the Game’s ongoing
success and survival.

 

[oldman]

Refereeing mainly youngsters (up to U16 or 17) I am hot on penalising swearing or abuse, couple of pens early doors usually gets the message across. However a few weeks back a player charged down a kick which hit him straight in the "family jewels". His language was choice containing a number of four letter words, and explitives. Given he was also the butt of several of his team mates comments I choose to ignore it.
The best comment 'Dont worry ***** you wont miss what you've never used'. i have to admit to a slight cuckle when I heard his mate say that.

 

[Chogan]

Thanks everyone for the feedback.
It did feel odd restarting with the peno as the offence occurred between the try and conversion.
As for "foul" language. I don't have a problem with it being used in general e.g. a player knocks-on and curses for making the mistake or there is a bit of a shove and an F-off (For the record i'd give that an "oi, watch it.")
In this instance it was clearly abusive and delivered with soul intent of getting a rise out of the opponent. I felt it was important to nip it quickly and forcefully before any player felt they could take matters further.

 

[OB..]

Neither do the mums and grandmas need to hear it.

Sadly I have to report that I have heard mums and grandmas using similar language, but I agree with the main thesis.

 

[Jacko]

Refereeing mainly youngsters (up to U16 or 17) I am hot on penalising swearing or abuse, couple of pens early doors usually gets the message across. However a few weeks back a player charged down a kick which hit him straight in the "family jewels". His language was choice containing a number of four letter words, and explitives. Given he was also the butt of several of his team mates comments I choose to ignore it.
The best comment 'Dont worry ***** you wont miss what you've never used'. i have to admit to a slight cuckle when I heard his mate say that.

This reminds me of a story I was once told about a particularly God-fearing ref in my society (it's probably apocryphal).
The ref always insisted on no swearing at all in his games and warned the players pre-match to that effect. Minimum of a penalty for any that slipped out. In one game, a player dislocated his knee and was writhing about in agony on the floor. The ref trotted over to see how he was getting on. Having seen the amount of pain he was in, the ref says "Oh dear - that does look sore. In light of your pain, on this occasion I will allow you one swear".
"Oh **** off ref" comes the reply.

 

[tim White]

Sadly I have to report that I have heard mums and grandmas using similar language, but I agree with the main thesis.

Use a different bar, or don't stay so late in future.

 

[OB..]

Use a different bar, or don't stay so late in future.

I'm afraid it came from the sidelines. :norc: