[Law] After 3 unsuccessful scrums, you must award a penatly try ?

[CrouchTPEngage]

So I heard this from 2 sources this weekend. One being a Mr Austin Healey on BT Sport commentary.
I used to chastise people who think like this but perhaps I;m now wrong and there has been a recent directive.
Mr Healey (paraphrase) , talking about the referee , "That's only the 2nd scrum there and you need to wait to have 3 scrums until you award a penalty try"

My view has always been, whilst I can Yellow-card for repeated scrum offences, I cannot award a PT unless a try would probably have been scored if it were not for the offence. For me, this means that the scrum would have to be moving towards the goal-line first and then I see an offence..

Point is, there could be 2,3,4 or 5 reset scrums before a PT could be awarded ?
( I refer you to the final 10 mins of the France v Wales 2017 6 Nations game as an example )

 

[Dickie E]

So I heard this from 2 sources this weekend. One being a Mr Austin Healey on BT Sport commentary.
I used to chastise people who think like this but perhaps I;m now wrong and there has been a recent directive.
Mr Healey (paraphrase) , talking about the referee , "That's only the 2nd scrum there and you need to wait to have 3 scrums until you award a penalty try"

My view has always been, whilst I can Yellow-card for repeated scrum offences, I cannot award a PT unless a try would probably have been scored if it were not for the offence. For me, this means that the scrum would have to be moving towards the goal-line first and then I see an offence..

Point is, there could be 2,3,4 or 5 reset scrums before a PT could be awarded ?
( I refer you to the final 10 mins of the France v Wales 2017 6 Nations game as an example )

CTPE, you are unequivocally correct

 

[Lee Lifeson-Peart]

Any statement that starts with (or similar to) "Austin Healey said...." invariably has me alerted to another impending nugget of wisdom. I don't have BT Sport so I miss out on all this first hand but wait long enough and AH never fails to disappoint.

I agree with CTPE.

 

[Camquin]

Three offences is repeat offending and therefore a yellow card.
But the PT could come on the first scrum if I thought a try would probably be scored.
And if they have shoved you back 4 metres, i would assume they would make the next metre.

 

[Marc Wakeham]

I stopped reading after seeing the words "Mr Austin Healey" I knew then it would be guff.

 

[Phil E]

Agree with all of the above.

 

[beckett50]

So I heard this from 2 sources this weekend. One being a Mr Austin Healey on BT Sport commentary.
I used to chastise people who think like this but perhaps I;m now wrong and there has been a recent directive.
Mr Healey (paraphrase) , talking about the referee , "That's only the 2nd scrum there and you need to wait to have 3 scrums until you award a penalty try"

I was watching that and my wife came done from upstairs at the expletives I issued at the TV when he said that. What a fool!

Not aware of any Premiership protocols that state this either.

 

[Dickie E]

I was watching that and my wife came done from upstairs at the expletives I issued at the TV when he said that. What a fool!

that's not nice of her to talk to you like that! :sad:

 

[Ciaran Trainor]

What should happen in the professional game is that after the first collapse the clock is stopped until there is a successful end to to scrum or there is a penalty. Nothing worse than watching a succession of failed scrums especially when teams are clearly running the clock down

 

[menace]

that's not nice of her to talk to you like that! :sad:

I thought he was calling her a fool!!!?? :shrug::shrug:

 

[Dickie E]

I thought he was calling her a fool!!!?? :shrug::shrug:

unlikely as he is still alive & posting

 

[Phil E]

For those who enjoy a good scrum battle (all the backs can go and iron their socks) have a look at Bath v Leicester from last week.
Fast forward to 20 minutes on the game clock. 22 minutes on the video clock.

https://www.premiershiprugby.com/full-match-video/

 

[didds]

well that wasn't a scrum battle at all. There wasn't much battling going on.

That was to some degree boys against men. A TH on his first premiership game this season (or since whenever) and a replacement that has never propped at that level before.

There has to be a question about whether either or both of those Bath TH's were ST&E in context of this level.

didds

 

[Dickie E]

not sure what the first YC was for

 

[didds]

wasn't it off his feet at the jackal?

didds

 

[Shelflife]

What should happen in the professional game is that after the first collapse the clock is stopped until there is a successful end to to scrum or there is a penalty. Nothing worse than watching a succession of failed scrums especially when teams are clearly running the clock down

Disagree Ctrainor

What should happen in the professional game is that the refs should apply the relevant laws and penalise the team in the wrong, if they continue to infringe then they card the offending player.

professional scrums are a joke to be honest.

 

[CrouchTPEngage]

not sure what the first YC was for

Yeah. I thought that. Ball was of the ground. Both the defender and the 9 went hands on at the same time.
So good contest for me. Not even a penalty.
However, it would have been different if the ball was on the ground, at the back of the ruck ( ex-ruck) and the nine trying to play it.
In THAT case , defo a penalty for me.

 

[DocY]

There have been two instances of this that have had me tearing my hair out recently: the Blues v. one of the South African teams a few weeks ago and Scarlets v. Dragons on Saturday just gone.

The second one was particularly egregious: first scrum of the set (there was no one successful scrum in the 60 minutes I saw) should have been a PT - Scarlets moving forward rapidly, collapsed very close to the Dragons' line, but no, play on for several more resets and a YC, then award a PT when the scrum went straight down before moving an inch!

That's pro 14 reffing for you!

 

[Marc Wakeham]

What was your opinion on the Cheetahs Vs Cardiff game?

 

[DocY]

What was your opinion on the Cheetahs Vs Cardiff game?

Cracking game, even as a neutral. That Haloholo is some player! I wonder where his grandparents come from.

The ending was a bit frustrating, though. IMO Cuthbert's YC shouldn't have been - it was a credible attempt at an interception - before the PT for repeated infringements.

Perhaps most interestingly, though - they didn't stop the clock at all after the 80 minutes, just as Barnes didn't last year.