Bledisloe 2

Status
Not open for further replies.

Ian_Cook


Referees in New Zealand
Staff member
Joined
Jul 12, 2005
Messages
13,684
Post Likes
1,770
Current Referee grade:
Level 2
Normal transmission has been resumed:biggrin:
 

The Fat


Referees in Australia
Joined
Jul 15, 2010
Messages
4,204
Post Likes
496
Steve Hansen refereeing?

Couple of dodgey calls both ways but no, Wallabies just didn't have an answer to AB's attack.
McKenzie has to start Phipps and Foley at 9 & 10 for next game and it would be good if the forwards could turn up in time to play the first 60 minutes of the next game as well.

When Nonu is fit to return it should be from the bench. ABs were slick with Conrad Smith back in the team.
 

Ian_Cook


Referees in New Zealand
Staff member
Joined
Jul 12, 2005
Messages
13,684
Post Likes
1,770
Current Referee grade:
Level 2
You cannot keep playing Beale at 10. He is not a 1st 5/8. He was running sideways most of the night.

Folau doesn't have the "rugby smarts" in his game yet. He is still reverting to type.....RL. He bombed two tries tonight because he lacks the ability to do the "heads up" play under pressure.

Beale to fullback.
Folau to the wing ahead of McCabe who should go to 12
Toomua to 5/8
 

Lee Lifeson-Peart


Referees in England
Joined
Mar 12, 2008
Messages
7,815
Post Likes
1,008
Current Referee grade:
Level 6
I'm cross. I had a look for B2 on the Sky+ box, couldn't find it so assumed it was next week. Bugger! Highlights might be on later.
 

Browner

Banned
Joined
Jan 20, 2012
Messages
6,000
Post Likes
270
Presumably devoid of refereeing errors this time ? :)
 

irishref


Referees in Holland
Joined
Oct 15, 2011
Messages
978
Post Likes
63
With a scoreline like that then any reffing error is not going to have a material effect. I thought 1 AllBlacks try should not have stood:

Folau made his only decent break in the first half from deep and got into the AllBlack's 22, was tackled very high but ref played on, without an advantage. 2 further passes by Aus, they lost possession and a breakaway try is scored by the AllBlacks.
 

irishref


Referees in Holland
Joined
Oct 15, 2011
Messages
978
Post Likes
63
Oh yeah, can I just say to those that didn't see the game:

Sir Ruchie was yellow carded, in front of a NZ public, for a bit of cynical interference at the breakdown.

Shall I put that in bold? :france: Allez Romaine!!
 

The Fat


Referees in Australia
Joined
Jul 15, 2010
Messages
4,204
Post Likes
496
Presumably devoid of refereeing errors this time ? :)

When you watch a game where you've just had ya bum smacked by 30+ points and you've had your supporters hat on rather than your neutral referee's hat.......... you can find a penalty at just about every phase. The reality is that there were a couple of non-calls that deserve discussion that went the AB's way and probably a few more ruck and scrum feed infringements that were not pinged against the Wallabies.
I'll discuss the two non-calls that went the ABs way only and leave the others that went the other way for others to raise if they wish.

1. As already pointed out by irishref,
"Folau made his only decent break in the first half from deep and got into the AllBlack's 22, was tackled very high but ref played on, without an advantage. 2 further passes by Aus, they lost possession and a breakaway try is scored by the AllBlacks".

2. Folau makes a long run down the left in the 2nd half and is tackled by the last defender about 1m in from touch. As he hits the ground, a second defender falls on him and then the two defenders roll the tackled player out over the touch line. Instead of PK to Aus, we have a LO to the ABs. AR was right alongside the tackle. Of course this situation could have been avoided if Folau had some support available to either pass or dummy to. I need to see a replay of this one so I can see how far away his support was. Really hoping they actually make it into the camera view so that I know they weren't all just standing 50m back yelling "Go Izzy"
 

The Fat


Referees in Australia
Joined
Jul 15, 2010
Messages
4,204
Post Likes
496
And I didn't bother for the last 30mins of that game. It wasn't worth it.

Bloody woeful.

I managed to go the distance but you have to remember that I've had plenty of practice over the last 10 years being both a Wallabies AND Waratahs supporter:wink:
 

Ian_Cook


Referees in New Zealand
Staff member
Joined
Jul 12, 2005
Messages
13,684
Post Likes
1,770
Current Referee grade:
Level 2
Oh yeah, can I just say to those that didn't see the game:

Sir Ruchie was yellow carded, in front of a NZ public, for a bit of cynical interference at the breakdown.

Shall I put that in bold? :france: Allez Romaine!!

Footnote: Then he went on to score TWO tries, make 9 tackles, and do this after the match...

39887.2.jpg


That's already in bold.
 

Ian_Cook


Referees in New Zealand
Staff member
Joined
Jul 12, 2005
Messages
13,684
Post Likes
1,770
Current Referee grade:
Level 2
When you watch a game where you've just had ya bum smacked by 30+ points and you've had your supporters hat on rather than your neutral referee's hat.......... you can find a penalty at just about every phase. The reality is that there were a couple of non-calls that deserve discussion that went the AB's way and probably a few more ruck and scrum feed infringements that were not pinged against the Wallabies.
I'll discuss the two non-calls that went the ABs way only and leave the others that went the other way for others to raise if they wish.

1. As already pointed out by irishref,
"Folau made his only decent break in the first half from deep and got into the AllBlack's 22, was tackled very high but ref played on, without an advantage. 2 further passes by Aus, they lost possession and a breakaway try is scored by the AllBlacks".

2. Folau makes a long run down the left in the 2nd half and is tackled by the last defender about 1m in from touch. As he hits the ground, a second defender falls on him and then the two defenders roll the tackled player out over the touch line. Instead of PK to Aus, we have a LO to the ABs. AR was right alongside the tackle. Of course this situation could have been avoided if Folau had some support available to either pass or dummy to. I need to see a replay of this one so I can see how far away his support was. Really hoping they actually make it into the camera view so that I know they weren't all just standing 50m back yelling "Go Izzy"

Yep, I agree with these two. They should have been PKs to Australia, although just prior to the first one, Cory Jane was hit with a blatant late tackle just after he kicked near the sideline. Also, Frank's YC at the end was a crock. He was pinged for playing the ball on the ground, but what really happened was that he knocked Wallabies player's arm causing him to lose the ball.

Swings and roundabouts, none of which made any difference to the result.
 

winchesterref


Referees in England
Joined
Dec 14, 2009
Messages
2,014
Post Likes
197
Current Referee grade:
Select Grade
Thought overall Poite had a good game, in what would have been a massive fitness test at the pace of the game! Bet he's a tad sore today.

Wallabies looked good for first 25, some nice hands and unit interplay, but NZ were clinical and pretty solid in D. Some strides being made by the Aussies anyway, look 100% better than this time last year
 

Chogan


Referees in Ireland
Joined
Feb 3, 2012
Messages
412
Post Likes
8
Current Referee grade:
National Panel
No peno for Jane's high tackle did affect the result.

14 point swing at that stage was huge
 

Ian_Cook


Referees in New Zealand
Staff member
Joined
Jul 12, 2005
Messages
13,684
Post Likes
1,770
Current Referee grade:
Level 2
No peno for Jane's high tackle did affect the result.

14 point swing at that stage was huge

1. 10 point swing as there was no guarantee that the Wallabies would have scored a converted try.

2. People who were at the ground said they heard Stu Berry and Poite communicate about the Jane tackle (presumably on "Sports Ears"). Seems the TO3 didn't miss it, they saw it and decided it was "play on".

3. Just prior to the Jane tackle, there was a blatant late tackle on Jane himself after he kicked, also not called.

4. Its impossible to say what effect any of this had because as soon as you substitute what you think a decision should have been for what actually happened, the game restarts in a different place. This is what annoys me about idiots who, after a 5 point loss bemoan the two missed penalty goals in the first half. They don't understand that if either of them were successful, the game restarts differently (half way instead of 22m) and will unfold differently as a consequence. Who is to know that if Jane had been PK....

a. Beale hits the upright and the All Blacks go the length of the field to score anyway.
b. Beale kicks the penalty goal, and the All Blacks score from the restart
c. Beale misses and the All Blacks drop out to halfway
d. The Wallabies turn down the shot at goal and kick into the corner, but throw crooked to the line-out or concede a line-out PK

etc, etc.
 

BikingBud


Referees in England
Joined
Oct 8, 2011
Messages
739
Post Likes
261
Current Referee grade:
Select Grade
Not sure it was the missed pen that was the swing but Folau's inability to see the chance and pass left. I think we were all probably screaming at the tv.

But we don't comment upon poor decisions by players as clearly they have no impact upon the result! Only the ref can do that!!

PS

I would add that OZ did not really need to be chasing the game at that stage and were, IMHO, forcing the game.
 
Last edited:

Chogan


Referees in Ireland
Joined
Feb 3, 2012
Messages
412
Post Likes
8
Current Referee grade:
National Panel
1. 10 point swing as there was no guarantee that the Wallabies would have scored a converted try.

Applying the logic you used for point 4, if the peno is given, ABs might not have scored another try. The discussion IMHO is about 2 trys, one for gold which could have happened and one for black that did. As we are talking about trys and obviously the subsequent conversions I'm sticking with 14 points. Gold may indeed have taken three having blown the advantage but 14 is the potential max swing of points in this incident.

2. People who were at the ground said they heard Stu Berry and Poite communicate about the Jane tackle (presumably on "Sports Ears"). Seems the TO3 didn't miss it, they saw it and decided it was "play on".

That's great.
[LAWS]10.4.(e) Dangerous Tackling.
A player must not tackle (or try to tackle) an opponent above the line of the shoulders even if the tackle starts below the line of the shoulders. A tackle around the opponent’s neck or head is dangerous play.[/LAWS]

Craig Joubert decided Richie gave a peno away in the Super final. Doesn't make it the correct decision. The tackle was high, therefore illegal and a penalty should have been given as a consequence.

3. Just prior to the Jane tackle, there was a blatant late tackle on Jane himself after he kicked, also not called.

I saw it. It was an attempted charge down which resulted in the charger and kicker colliding, not a late tackle and it was far form blatant.
[LAWS]10.4.(o) Late-charging the kicker.
A player must not intentionally charge or obstruct an opponent who has just kicked the ball.[/LAWS]

The law clearly asks for a demonstration of intent. This clearly places the interpretation of the action on the referee. His call and can be debated till the cows come home.

4. Its impossible to say what effect any of this had because as soon as you substitute what you think a decision should have been for what actually happened, the game restarts in a different place.
Correct.
This is what annoys me about idiots who, after a 5 point loss bemoan the two missed penalty goals in the first half. They don't understand that if either of them were successful, the game restarts differently (half way instead of 22m) and will unfold differently as a consequence. Who is to know that if Jane had been PK....
Hardly idiots. It is rather perceptive to recognise and debate the ebb and flow of the territorial battle coupled with possession and points total at a given point of a game and the effect it has on the rest of the match.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Top