Boys will be boys III

[SimonSmith]

I guess I didn't state an opinion.

I can't see a tackle there. It may - or may not - be a maul, but there are two players on the ground, equally at fault. Blow it up quickly, and attacking ball.

 

[Dixie]

Quick whistle. Attacking scrum. Be pragmatic as BFG says.

What if the attackers had been the original ball carriers, and the defence had been the checkers/wrestlers, with attacking support having formed the maul before breaking off? Still an attacking scrum?

 

[FlipFlop]

From what I can make out, and bearing in mind the laws are a framework to get a game:

If it was a maul - which has then collapsed: scrum blue
If it was a "mess on the floor" - attacking (blue) scrum
If it was a tackle, and the ball was trapped - scrum team going forward (blue)
If it was a tackle and players not doing what they should - PK against (red/blue)

I'd argue that there is a potential for a tackle, so Blue should have released tackled player. BUT at that level, as it wasn't obviously a tackle, the quick whistle, explanation, and scrum is probably better. In all scrum scenarios the scrum goes to blue. So scrum blue.

I'd probably make my life easy by either calling the maul asap it formed (no doubt then) or calling "Tackle - Blue release" if I went down the tackle route. Speed of tought and decision, means you don't get stuck in the corner sometimes. Quick whistles also mean awarding the scrum (as opposed to PK) is easier, you can always use the (cringe) "It's a mess, blue going forward, scrum blue", and if a player starts to complain, you can usually shut them up pretty quickly with a "Would you rather I PK'ed your player for (holding on/not rolling/etc) on the floor?" (not said as a question - no debate to be entered into)

So I think you might (or might not) have got the technically correct decision, but I think you got the right decision for the game you were involved in. The thing to learn next is how to sell these decisions to the players/coaches/crowd. Which is where loud calls of T/R/M comes in, being confident, sounding authoritative and certain, no hessitation, and especially being right in most your other calls, and a loud explanation "Maul had formed, gone to ground, ball not available, red took it in, blue ball" or "Only a tackle there, ball not coming out, blue going forward, blue ball"

 

[Davet]

Which is where loud calls of T/R/M comes in, being confident, sounding authoritative and certain, no hessitation, and especially being right in most your other calls, and a loud explanation "Maul had formed, gone to ground, ball not available, red took it in, blue ball" or "Only a tackle there, ball not coming out, blue going forward, blue ball"

Seconded.

 

[Greg Collins]

Twas only me that was bothered. None of the crowd, neither of the coaches or any of the home coachlettes voiced any complaint at the time (right in front of the massed prowling coachlettes btw) nor did they mention it in the debrief afterwards. Only the blue player had anthing to say and he was dealt with swiftly and justly and was as fine as nine pence. Selling the decision was easy thanks to application of the excellent advice given in here in the past as per this thread. Skill levels of the game was a 9.5 based on my limited experience of 10 and lower, but execution often hampered by the long break we've had.

 

[Taff]

..... Which is where loud calls of T/R/M comes in, being confident, sounding authoritative and certain, no hessitation ..

Sorry. T/R/M? :chin:

 

[Greg Collins]

We've been advised by local version of TPTB (DB) explicitly NOT to call 'maul' anymore. No longer in fashion. The pendulum is swinging back away from the commentating ref. it seems.

Maul forming:- I've been coached/advised/told to allow a bit of time and allow something more like a classic maul to form (even if only of three players) before solemnly intoning the 'M' word and reffing the phase as such. This maulette never passed the threshold for a credible maul imo.

Maul going down:- Is the perceived wisdom to say nothing at all when it hits the deck then and to blow in a trice, instantly, rather than im-med-i-ate-ly. We've been told in the past to tell them to let go, by a clear call of 'release', and a 'good' if they do, if they do it comes out game on, otherwise unsuccessful end. Seems to work ok at L12 & L11... not been pulled up on it by watchers anyway.

What say those more experienced than I?

 

[Greg Collins]

Sorry. T/R/M? :chin:

Tackle Ruck Maul