From ARU online referee course

[Balones]

I'm with CR with this - unless the question is being asked to test a ref's thought processes rather than get a "right answer" it does seem somewhat of a clever-cloggs-gotcha question.

TBH IF it ever happened in a game I reckon you can sell it either way. Lets face it - whichever way you call it one side will think you are wrong anyway.

didds

In general I would agree but add the caveat that it may depend on the level of game it happened in.

 

[crossref]

Wouldn't be a reward if you were being stuffed in the scrums!

but if that was the case they would use it...

 

[crossref]

In general I would agree but add the caveat that it may depend on the level of game it happened in.

but what level of game would a team steal the ball at a maul, successfully make it available, but then fail to Use It ..

a kids game perhaps?

 

[Balones]

but what level of game would a team steal the ball at a maul, successfully make it available, but then fail to Use It ..

a kids game perhaps?

Sorry. I was really referring to Didd's second paragraph only.

 

[Pegleg]

Wouldn't be a reward if you were being stuffed in the scrums!

In which case you would get the ball out. Come on now.

 

[Pegleg]

but what level of game would a team steal the ball at a maul, successfully make it available, but then fail to Use It ..

a kids game perhaps?

Come on kids would not be that stupid.

 

[Camquin]

If teams always used the ball quickly, we would not have a law requiring the ref to tell them to use it.

 

[Pegleg]

Indeed not. That is why WR tried to stop the time wasting tactic. To suggest that they get a second benefit would be stupid.

The point of the above post is that kids would not be stupid enough to hold the ball in if their scrum was poor knowign tht doing so would result in a scrum.

 

[Dickie E]

silly structure for the question as well .. choose the sentence which is wrong ..

Of course! I've just reread the question! It's the old double negative - second time this week I've been caught out! Please disregard the OP. And apologies to ARU for ever doubting them.

 

[crossref]

So in the unlikely event of this really happening on the pitch, what would you actually give ?

 

[Balones]

What were the other statements? The OP says which of the following statementS.... etc.

 

[Dickie E]

What were the other statements? The OP says which of the following statementS.... etc.

multiple choice with 4 options. I can no longer access as I have completed the test. Sorry.

 

[Pegleg]

So in the unlikely event of this really happening on the pitch, what would you actually give ?

The side failing to use the ball does not get the reward of the scrum. Common sense!

 

[crossref]

The side failing to use the ball does not get the reward of the scrum. Common sense!

that's what I would give, but I thought the ARU were saying the opposite.

 

[Pegleg]

The question was "which statement is wrong?"

So saying that the team taking tbe ball in loses ir in this case is WRONG. That is the statement titled "correct Answer" is correct because it is wrong.

Rugby is in good hands with WR and some of our Unions!

 

[ChrisR]

That's one thing to agree about: The question sucks!

The reason that I posted the commentary below was not to be a smartass but to illustrate the ambiguities that can quickly arise in this kind of scenario that makes the refs decision difficult.

The referee is responding to his assessor who has questioned why he awarded the scrum to a particular side and is writing his report.

Well, Mr. Reportwriter Sir, the ball was caught by Red from a Blue kick in open play (was that kick from a PK open play or a restart?) , the catcher took two steps (was that immediate or not?) before Blue wrapped him up and drove him backwards (Blue definitely going forward) as Red support joined (now we have a maul). At some point the ball was stripped from Red (did that happen before or after the maul formed?) but Red was driving forward (are Red now the side going forward?) when the whole mess collapsed (was that intentional?) . Blue placed the ball on the ground (does that make it a successful end to the maul?) and it was immediately available to the Blue SH.

I called "Use it!" but he was too busy picking his nose so after 5 secs I said (to myself) "**** this, if you don't want it you don't get it" and awarded a scrum to Red.

Now this last part would never happen (well, about as frequently than a zombie apocalypse) but it's the only non-ambiguous part of the whole event so that's what I'd call.

 

[crossref]

So , I am still confused.

who does the ARU think should get the scrum --
- Team A (because B failed to use it) or
- Team B (because Team A had possession when the maul started)

I'd give the scrum to Team A, as would pegleg and Dickie E
I can see Ian and Balones would give it to B

Both sides have claimed that the ARU agrees with them!

What a rubbishly worded question !

 

[Balones]

I sense there is a strong concensus with your last sentence crossref.

 

[Jolly Roger]

As Pegleg points out in #10 the team failing to use the ball loses th ball. That is what the law says. It is not an issue of what seems right but a fact of law.

 

[Jolly Roger]

I have just downloaded the 2018 law book which states:

LAW 16
15. When a maul has stopped moving towards a goal line, it may restart moving towards a goal line providing it does so within five seconds. If it stops a second time but the ball is being moved and the referee can see it, the referee instructs the team to use the ball. The team in possession must then use the ball in a reasonable time. Sanction: Scrum.

So no change there.