[Kit] Illegal studs

[mcroker]

I ref a mix of grassroots and youth rugby...

When I do my boot inspection it is usual to have one or two studs that whilst not sharp, don’t confirm to Reg 12 (eg football studs not 1cm across at end).

it seems overly officious to me to stop them taking part - and what I usually do is warn them in the presence of their capt. of the issue and that if I see them near another player I am going straight to my pocket.

How does everybody else handle it?

 

[Christy]

hi mcroker.
i would advise you dont pre warn said player , you are going for your pocket ..

if they are slightly worn away , but were clearly once proper studs , i would let them play no probs .
if they clearly wrong studs ,,dont let them play ..

go back to your pre warn penalty ,,,suppose you dont get there in time & a player gets his ear ripped off / similar .
last thing you need is a ,,,,oh & by the way the ref said i could play ..

 

[Marc Wakeham]

Why not ask them to change the stud if you think it illegal? I can't see any good coming from telling a player publicly that their studs are illegal and then allowign them to take the field with them.

 

[chbg]

Whilst you think that you know what are illegal studs, search this site for 'studs' and read a few of the threads e.g.
http://www.rugbyrefs.com/showthread.php?20777-SmartPower-Profiler-stud-set&highlight=studs
http://www.rugbyrefs.com/showthread.php?20734-Studs&highlight=studs
http://www.rugbyrefs.com/showthread.php?20522-Studs-Again&highlight=studs

 

[Zebra1922]

hi mcroker.
i would advise you dont pre warn said player , you are going for your pocket ..

if they are slightly worn away , but were clearly once proper studs , i would let them play no probs .
if they clearly wrong studs ,,dont let them play ..

go back to your pre warn penalty ,,,suppose you dont get there in time & a player gets his ear ripped off / similar .
last thing you need is a ,,,,oh & by the way the ref said i could play ..

I disagree. You cannot force a player to change boots/studs/clothing etc. What you can do is point out the consequences if they choose not to adhere to your instructions.

I warned a player about a missing stud leaving only one at the rear last year. 2 minutes before KO I check again and he still has not changed boots or added a stud (claiming no spare boots/studs). I made it clear to him, his captain and his coach if he took the field in those boots with no new studs I would red card. Lo and behold an alternate (legal) pair of boots arrives just in time.....

 

[crossref]

It's an interesting one. I don't see any Law against a missing rear stud, and if he had torn his Achilles and blamed it on the ill fitting boots you forced him to wear, I wonder where you would have stood in the court case

 

[mcroker]

Sorry clearly I failed to adequately search before posting ...

 

[SimonSmith]

It's an interesting one. I don't see any Law against a missing rear stud, and if he had torn his Achilles and blamed it on the ill fitting boots you forced him to wear, I wonder where you would have stood in the court case

My bet? On pretty ****ing safe ground

 

[mcroker]

You aren’t forcing him to do anything ... you are merely preventing him playing unless his remedies the defective boot.

That said I agree that there is nothing in law or regs that requires all studs to be present

 

[Marc Wakeham]

Whilst you think that you know what are illegal studs, search this site for 'studs' and read a few of the threads e.g.
http://www.rugbyrefs.com/showthread.php?20777-SmartPower-Profiler-stud-set&highlight=studs
http://www.rugbyrefs.com/showthread.php?20734-Studs&highlight=studs
http://www.rugbyrefs.com/showthread.php?20522-Studs-Again&highlight=studs

Not relevant! The scenario presented is the referee telling a player that the stud is not acceptable but the player can wear it anyway but must "behave".

Very different to a referee deciding that the stud is legal.

If you are going, effectively, to "ignore" a stud that you see as illegal. It is probably best to keep your
mouth shut about it.


But yes it is advisable to do your reseach as to what is and is not legal.

 

[Marc Wakeham]

I disagree. You cannot force a player to change boots/studs/clothing etc. What you can do is point out the consequences if they choose not to adhere to your instructions.

Semantics! "Either you change it or you will be sent off the first time I notice you've not done so." Is effectively forcing the issue.

I warned a player about a missing stud leaving only one at the rear last year. 2 minutes before KO I check again and he still has not changed boots or added a stud (claiming no spare boots/studs). I made it clear to him, his captain and his coach if he took the field in those boots with no new studs I would red card. Lo and behold an alternate (legal) pair of boots arrives just in time.....

If you decide that something is not legal of course you make it clear. Any sensible player carries spare studs. I actually carry spare and both long and short studs in case I lose one. I'd gove one to a player if needed.

 

[Taff]

... When I do my boot inspection it is usual to have one or two studs that whilst not sharp, don’t confirm to Reg 12 (eg football studs not 1cm across at end).

I wouldn't allow what I call "football studs" because they tend to be narrower than rugby studs.

Sorry clearly I failed to adequately search before posting ...

Researching is advisable but not compulsory. If in doubt - ask away.

.... If you decide that something is not legal of course you make it clear. Any sensible player carries spare studs. I actually carry spare and both long and short studs in case I lose one. I'd give one to a player if needed.

Whenever I buy new boots, I salvage the usable studs and keep them in my kit bag. If a player has lost a stud, it costs me nothing to offer them a replacement.

 

[Marc Wakeham]

Waste not, want not!

 

[Ciaran Trainor]

A real problem up here in RL land, attached photo happened to a friend of mine in training.
I carry a 10mm Across flats spanner with me. If the studs go through it they are not legal.
Stud check last week identified one guy with illegal studs.
Most people now think if there is no sharp burrs on them, anything goes.He said he'd played in them all last season with no problems...… not in my game and he changed them without any issues. Bonus was he was a scrum half

 

[ChrisR]

A real problem up here in RL land, attached photo happened to a friend of mine in training.
I carry a 10mm Across flats spanner with me. If the studs go through it they are not legal.
Stud check last week identified one guy with illegal studs.
Most people now think if there is no sharp burrs on them, anything goes.He said he'd played in them all last season with no problems...… not in my game and he changed them without any issues. Bonus was he was a scrum half

Nasty looking injury. But . . . was that injury caused by cleats <10mm?

 

[mcroker]

Interestingly the 2018 laws seem to have removed the requirement for the ref to inspect studs... (or I can't find it)

I think the advice to keep my mouth shut if I decide no to see something, is sound - and was followed today. Now I need to decide how good my vision is...

 

[crossref]

That's interesting .. no longer any obligation to make an inspection

That seems like a sensible change , designed to free the referee of some legal risk. If you are required to do an inspection then obliged to do it to a reasonable standard . And therefore scope for people to claim you didn't

I think I will therefore cease doing it

 

[OB..]

That's interesting .. no longer any obligation to make an inspection

That seems like a sensible change , designed to free the referee of some legal risk. If you are required to do an inspection then obliged to do it to a reasonable standard . And therefore scope for people to claim you didn't

I think I will therefore cease doing it

[LAWS]4.7 [FONT=fs_blakeregular]If, at an inspection before the match, a match official tells a player that an item banned under this law is being worn and the player is subsequently found to be wearing that item on the playing area, that player is sent off for misconduct.[/FONT][/LAWS]
It appears there is no official obligation, but there is an expectation. Part of your Duty of Care?

I suggest continuing to do a check. You don't want the first indication of dangerous studs to be an actual injury.

 

[crossref]

From a personal protection point of view that might actually be the best thing..

Doesn't the primary duty of care lie with the players?

 

[Christy]

Law 6.4
Tells us that the ref must inspect studs