Is it material ...

[didds]

The general directive we are given (and there are always exceptions of course) is that advantage is over when the team gets what they would otherwise have got.

So for a scrum or FK offence, a couple of clean passes with clean possesion does the trick.

So - just to get this clear...

example:

red throw but red then knock on in the lineout and the ball goes directly to the blue #9. He passes immediately to the blue #10 who is standing 10 metres behind the gain line (line of touch). Blue ten passes the ball from his static position (as he wasn't expecting it in defence) to his centre who is now standing 2 metres further back (having taken a step or two backwards when he saw the ball was coming their way). The ball is now 12 metres from the gain line, blue are not yet moving forward, haven't yet kicked the ball away, and that is advantage over?

Honestly?

Strewth...

didds

 

[TigerCraig]

So - just to get this clear...

example:

red throw but red then knock on in the lineout and the ball goes directly to the blue #9. He passes immediately to the blue #10 who is standing 10 metres behind the gain line (line of touch). Blue ten passes the ball from his static position (as he wasn't expecting it in defence) to his centre who is now standing 2 metres further back (having taken a step or two backwards when he saw the ball was coming their way). The ball is now 12 metres from the gain line, blue are not yet moving forward, haven't yet kicked the ball away, and that is advantage over?

Honestly?

Strewth...

didds

Thats not what I said (or not what I meant anyway). Clean possession implies time and space to use it.

For examples (Red throwing/Blue non throwing):

Blue have an extra man in, red win lineout, 9 gets good ball, passes to 10 in space who kicks, runs or passes under little pressure - play on

Blue have an extra man in and win line out - FK red

Blue have an extra man in and red throw in skew - FK red

Blue have an extra man in, red win lineout but ball to 9 isn't clean - let breathe, possibly FK red unless advantage accrues quickly

Blue have an extra man in, red bring ball down and start driving - let it breathe and if unable to get anywhere possibly FK red

Long advantages are a bugbear of mine, especially since 99% of our games are of 30 minute or less halves. Either let it go or bring it back but don;t have 12 phases going from 1 side of the field to the other only to end up coming back anyway.

For example, blue knock on, red recover, set up a nice stable ruck, get clean ball from 9 to 10, or even a charging 4 who gets over the ad line, thats advantage over for me.

 

[didds]

Certainly not what I inferred anyway...

I';m still not cionvinced becauyse i still see no tactical or territorial advantage after the two pases mentioned. Whatever.

So - what happens if blue in my example don;t actually want to run the ball from that field position, but would rather have the scrum for whatever tactical purposes theyt deem fit. What happens if the 12 now deliberately knocks on a la gregan?

didds

 

[Womble]

Didds, Having refereed for 20 years and coached senior rugby for 12 years the 2 will never see eye to eye, the 2 pass "rule" is a great directive for referees so long as the ball goes to space. From a knock on, 1. we stop the game, form a scrum, take a bit of time out ball comes in, we push and shove, ball comes out and is usually fed to the first receiver...... 2. ball is picked up, goes 2 passes and we play on.

For me, I would go with 2 every time I can ( so long as the team who have the advantage are not under undue pressure) the game can get very sterile and boring if you blow for everything & more so if the players want everything pinged as well. The game in England (lower levels ) needs to re learn how to enjoy playing and officiating. Less whistle =more rugby.

Lets remember that community rugby Level 4 down in the majority is played by people who work very hard in the week and wish to take part in a well controlled environment for their weekend recreation. Lets make all rugby peeps in England smile and enjoy their rugby this weekend, I know for sure that there will be many at the club I coach that do , even sir will have no choice but to smile and enjoy his day. :hap::hap::hap:

 

[didds]

Now - I don't have any issue with that at all

I was just uncomfortable with what appeared to be a mantra like "two passes, advantage over" interpretation that may be anything but in reality.

didds