NatWest 6 Nations 2018 Championship - talking points

Toby Warren


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Not odd at all - it was knocked on and Watson doesn't ground it - in goal or in field... (to be fair once I saw the KO the rest was kind of irrelevant).

Let's not disappear down a rabbit hole. Ireland 100% deserved to win and England haven't been robbed
 

Ian_Cook


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This is the replay from the halftime discussion. Clear and obvious knock on for me.

https://youtu.be/r1zhln8ExWI?t=3832


Agree.

A ball in flight does not suddenly change direction through 90°. This ball not only changed direction, but it suddenly changed the way it was tumbling as well. This only happens when the ball strikes something solid... in this case. the left hand of Green 15; clear and obvious.
 

L'irlandais

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My point being, it is odd that a finger touch deviation of some centimeters appears clear and obvious to you guys and yet it slipped your attention that Watson’s attempted grounding was over a meter within the in-goal area. (To those who suggested he had grounded the ball short of the line.) People see what they want to see. Was the ball clearly knocked forward? The movement could have been lateral from Green 15’s left hand. If it was so clear and obvious, how come the TMO over looked it? Perhaps because Watson was still in contact with the ball as it came to ground. As was pointed out previously, the referee asked about the grounding, not about the lead in to the possible try. In under 60 seconds the TMO had to make a call. It is quite possible he didn’t get to see that angle in the short time he had to make the call.
 
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ChuckieB

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I do not recall seeing the really telling angle of the potential KO until after the game. IIR KO possibility was not considered under the TRY? No Try? question.

Only mentioned as a dynamic contest for the ball in the air.
 

Rich_NL

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This is the replay from the halftime discussion. Clear and obvious knock on for me.

https://youtu.be/r1zhln8ExWI?t=3832

That's the one I was referring to, thank you! davidlandy - 1.04.14 on the youtube timer.

l'irlandais - if you think that was a lateral knock, you're an excellent example of your claim of people seeing what they want to see. :)

But to reiterate - it was a credible call from the TMO, we don't know if that was a camera to which he had access anyway, and no-one's claiming England was robbed of a win, Ireland were the better side.
 

ChrisR

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I think it's C&O that a green hand played the ball but not C&O from the clip that it went forward as it immediately struck the white shoulder.
 

davidlandy

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That's the one I was referring to, thank you! davidlandy - 1.04.14 on the youtube timer.

l'irlandais - if you think that was a lateral knock, you're an excellent example of your claim of people seeing what they want to see. :)

But to reiterate - it was a credible call from the TMO, we don't know if that was a camera to which he had access anyway, and no-one's claiming England was robbed of a win, Ireland were the better side.

There it is!

Thank you mjmg, and Rich_NL :)

I don't think the TMO wasn't shown this one at the time (assuming the live stream is what the TMO is seeing).

From what I can see, the ball definitely touches green 15's hand, and given that green 15 had a lot of forward momentum it's hard to imagine how it could have gone backwards.

However, having said that, I also agree with ChrisR that it's not possible to see (without making assumptions) in which direction it bounces before it hits the white shoulder. It is possible (although in my view not very likely) that it went laterally, or even slightly backwards, but on the visual evidence it's impossible to tell as we are viewing from directly behind the players.

Either way I think the TMO made not only a credible call, but the right call given the views he had, and all in under a minute or so.

I suppose this raises the question on whether a TMO can apply logic and physics or whether they are supposed to judge solely on visual evidence. Mind you, if you have to get your slide rule and protractor out, and study the replays for 15 hours, is it really C&O?

Why wasn't this view available to the TMO at the time? I thought they got all available views. Luckily it was at Twickers not Aviva otherwise conspiracy theories would no doubt abound :)

The Hand of God.jpg
 

Pinky


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The extra angle was one dug up for the pundits to talk about at half time. I agree that it looks in it like the ball is played by green 15, but it is not entirely c&o that it goes forward as it is hit by Waton's face and propelled into ig. The TMO watched a couple of replays of the contest in the air and then turned his attention to the grounding. I doubt he had time to look at all feeds at that stage. He said this to AG as he was doing so. All in all I think the correct question to the TMO by AG and as said above a credible decision by the TMO.
 

L'irlandais

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*Apart from their obvious typo on Wales, and getting one result wrong this weekend, the predictions are not far off points wise. Scotland were worth 16, only they butchered several chances; the game really was closer than the scoreline suggests:

Ireland 28-8 Scotland
France 22-16 England
Wales 38-14 Italy
Anybody seen QBE predictions for the final day of the Championship? A bit odd to fail to show the results of the predictor’s last simulation...

Then again, the first result the QBE number cruncher failed to predict correctly this 6 Nations tournament was Scotland v England. The second failed prediction was France v England.

My guess is their soulless algorithm only predicts trends; and England would still have been predicted to win at home. Only in their hearts QBE staff knew Saturday os St. Paddy’s Day the result can only go one way.
 

crossref


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I won my office competition with 3/3 winners 2/3 losers BP and 6/6 four-try BP predicted successful

I didn't know it was St Patrick day, I just reckoned Ireland were on fire and England were off the boil
 
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