Really? Two questions........

[OB..]

If a player was skilled enough to turn facing his own goal line and back heel grubber the ball into the oppositions for a onside player to ground it , you'd want to cancel the try , cos it was kicked with his heel ???

There is nothing that says hitting the ball with the heel is illegal, any more than hitting it with your head is illegal. It is the surrounding circumstances that matter. You cannot use a heel where a kick is specified eg at a penalty or a kick-off. You cannot use the heel if you release the ball forward first because the long-standing conventional exemption for a kick does not apply.

 

[didds]

"kicking" with the heel and not allowing a score is a definitive no go in the laws - with repsect to goals.

didds

 

[OB..]

"kicking" with the heel and not allowing a score is a definitive no go in the laws - with repsect to goals.

didds

Yes, but scoring a try after such a play would be OK.

 

[didds]

For the avoidance of doubt, yes, I agree with OB.

didds

 

[Browner]

For starters, "a visible distance out of the hand" covers punts. Please note the word "or" after that part to indicate the option of kicking the ball along the ground...it doesn't say "and".

In the second part, you said kicked with a heel...well this is impossible as hitting the ball with the heel isn't a kick by definition, in the same way that hitting a ball with your knee isn't a kick. I would ref it the same way.

Finally, the kick definition isn't there to define a penalty, it's there to define a kick. ANY kick. That's why it's under definitions and not just under Law 21. Note Law 7.1 which requires a definition for a kick.

[LAWS]7.1 Playing a match

Any player may throw it or kick it.

[/LAWS]

You've not picked up on the subtlety of my point re the 'kick definition' wording, which if applied absolutely, would bar most kicks!
I'm casting doubt on the wording, which seems lifted from the Law 21 wordings.

I'll try and make my point easier, virtually all kicks aren't made from out of the hand, the ball has invariably left the hand ie..been thrown before kicked. So we know the kick definition isn't wholly accurate, I'm saying that it was never intended to prohibit open play heel kicking ( as per BoD) it was intended to deal with what was/was not a legitimate Pen or Free 'kick' where heeling it meant that it wasn't obvious to the opposition that it had been taken. That's all.

 

[thepercy]

Can we get back to the first and more important question, TIGHTS! ON A REFEREE. The referee is not female, where an exception can be made for modesty, they are not of a cotton blend and have an outside seam.

 

[OB..]

Browner
[LAWS][FONT=fs_blakeregular]a kick must move the ball a visible distance [/FONT]out of the hand[FONT=fs_blakeregular],[/FONT][/LAWS]means touching the ball on your boot while holding it does not constitute a kick.

 

[Ian_Cook]

In previous discussion on this point we have recognised that in practice it is not always possible to be sure what part of the player's body it hit last. For most practical purposes it is usually ruled a knock-on unless very clearly not eg chesting the ball down with hands out to the side.

So, next time we see a player fumble a catch, and we see it clearly go backwards out of his hands and bounce off his chest, and we clearly see that it didn't touch his hands or arms again before landing a few feet in front of him, that will be play-on

Got it!


edit to add: :sarc:

 

[woody]

I'm just impressed to see two teams I used to ref make the Rugbyonslaught.

Go Rugby Oregon!

 

[irishref]

Feeling on watching first time at normal speed: knock on.

Feeling after the benefit of a slow-mo replay - hits his calf after leaving the hands backwards, so not a knock-on.

Fully empathise with the knock-on call though. Looks like the tights may be medical? Weather doesn't look bad.

 

[Browner]

Browner
[LAWS][FONT=fs_blakeregular]a kick must move the ball a visible distance [/FONT]out of the hand[FONT=fs_blakeregular],[/FONT][/LAWS]means touching the ball on your boot while holding it does not constitute a kick.

Zzzzzz. I know it intends to define when a free kick is executed, or not.

But its not intended to 'absolutely' define all other kick types, coz otherwise you could only 'kick' the ball if it was being clasped by your fingers at the point of contact ie "out of it" .......... Or, only kicks along the ground would be deemed " kicks" all others wouldn't.

I'm sticking with ... Heel kicking the ball in open play is fine, but as a FK,PK ( or kick at goal -ie no piss taking!) actioning, it isn't acceptable.

 

[TheBFG]

he looks a proper plumb in those leggings though! :norc:

 

[OB..]

Zzzzzz. I know it intends to define when a free kick is executed, or not.

But its not intended to 'absolutely' define all other kick types, coz otherwise you could only 'kick' the ball if it was being clasped by your fingers at the point of contact ie "out of it" .......... Or, only kicks along the ground would be deemed " kicks" all others wouldn't.

I'm sticking with ... Heel kicking the ball in open play is fine, but as a FK,PK ( or kick at goal -ie no piss taking!) actioning, it isn't acceptable.

I have said several times that there is nothing illegal in using your heel; it just doesn't count as a kick.