Schools game lack of response from players

[peperami]

Hi

Today I did an u16 schools game and had a match observer present. My penalty count was very high. After approximately 25 minutes I had cause to speak to both captains that their players where not responding to my instructions / communication. I asked them both to speak to their players and gave them time to speak to them. They genuinely did talk to the players.

However it didnt make any difference and I had to speak to both captains about penalties again early in the second half. Eventually I felt I had no choice but to get a yellow card out and then ended up with another card for team offence.

I spoke to my match observer and he genuinely felt that I had given the players ample opportunity to comply and that I was consistent and clear in my instructions. Also not giving the players unusual instructions or interpretations.

So my question is any suggestions on what I could have done perhaps to prevent this situation, and would you at u16 schools level simply have applied a more adult based card regime and gone for the card at 3/4 offence for the same thing.

Both sets of coaches thought I had a good game and the players where positive as well. So maybe I am just beating myself up but interested in what people think.

 

[winchesterref]

Sounds to me like the cards should have come out earlier. May get different responses from others, but U16 is not a huge way off a colt to an adult, I would expect them to know and adhere to the rules at that age

 

[andyscott]

yeah a early warning and a card may help tidy things up, what did you feel like?

Did you think the card was correctly timed?

 

[Stuartg]

Did you alert the coaches at half time to the problem areas. I had a wonderful match today where one side had repeatedly gone off their feet. After 3 times I had words with the captain, after 4 I gave a big hint that the yellow card was the likely next step. I'm pretty sure the coach had words at half time and in the second half they did not go off their feet at all. i was being assesssed, and so was my assessor and both of them said my management was correct. They felt that all too often refs reach for the YC too readily rather than working at managing the situation. The match was full of open passing rugby and I thoroughly enjoyed it.

 

[TigerCraig]

Had you had a good chat to the captains before the game? The problem at juniors (although hopefully not at Under 16) is when you have the "Johnny is the captain this week because its his turn" situation. These guys are generally not a lot of help compared to a regular captain who knows their stuff and how to solve problems

 

[Dickie E]

Did you alert the coaches at half time to the problem areas.

Interesting. We make a point of NOT talking to coaches during the game and especially at 1/2 time.

 

[Browner]

Interesting. We make a point of NOT talking to coaches during the game and especially at 1/2 time.

& the main reasons why you don't, are?

 

[peperami]

I had a chat with the captains before the game and explained, that I wanted the conversation through them and at down time as appropriate and that i would communicate and it would help if the players listened.

The captains tried their hardest to be fair and did take my messages back and explain them to the boys and were getting frustrated like me that I would use comms and the players where ignoring it.

I didnt directly speak to the coaches but they were both near by when I spoke to the captains and had been heard to utter, he's telling you what to do to avoid getting penalised so listen. They also must have spoken to them at half time as we we got through the 3rd Quarter before producing a yellow.

Like StuartG I was trying not to get a card out desperately as in the past I have been a little card happy.

The boys and coaches seemed to enjoy the game with a number of comments from boys on both sides and coaches of a positive nature.

- - - Updated - - -

I had a chat with the captains before the game and explained, that I wanted the conversation through them and at down time as appropriate and that i would communicate and it would help if the players listened.

The captains tried their hardest to be fair and did take my messages back and explain them to the boys and were getting frustrated like me that I would use comms and the players where ignoring it.

I didnt directly speak to the coaches but they were both near by when I spoke to the captains and had been heard to utter, he's telling you what to do to avoid getting penalised so listen. They also must have spoken to them at half time as we we got through the 3rd Quarter before producing a yellow.

Like StuartG I was trying not to get a card out desperately as in the past I have been a little card happy.

The boys and coaches seemed to enjoy the game with a number of comments from boys on both sides and coaches of a positive nature.

 

[crossref]

the only thing I'd say : don't shy away from carding an u16 just because he is an u16. They will be used to cards and if something's worth a card they'll be expecting a card.

 

[Drift]

& the main reasons why you don't, are?

Personally I don't want to listen to their bitching and trying to get me to change my interpretation of something. I like to use the halftime break to talk with my ARs on how things are progressing in the game, perhaps crack a joke or two and then get back into the game.

A law debate with a coach isn't going to help anyone.

 

[SimonSmith]

As my team of referees found out this weekend, one early card can save you three later.

One of my crew had a lower level game than he is used to. Really scrappy, bad quality rugby. And he refereed down to that level - not a great deal of management in the first half. Second half was a card fest, and the rugby didn't improve.

I had a similar situation the day afterwards. Except: I was 8 minutes in, and the attacking team took a quick tap 15m from the line. A defender who was only 3m from the tap made a tackle. Out came the card. The rest of the match was played with great attitude, and the lowest penalty count I've had all season.

It's a bit of a gamble, because if the players don't respond to the first card, you're walking down a tough path. But that won't be your fault.

As a general rule, when your question involves the general concept of "I waited as long as I could before going to my pocket", the answer will, 99% of the time, have the idea "and 'as long as I could' was too long"