[Tackle] Tackles player rolling away

[didds]

15.5 The tackled player
(b)
A tackled player must immediately pass the ball or release it. That player must also get up or move away from it at once.
Sanction: Penalty kick

In 41 years of playing, coaching, supporting etc I've never once seen anyone ever pinged for this, at any level.

So why is it even still in the laws?

didds

 

[Not Kurt Weaver]

15.5 The tackled player
(b)
A tackled player must immediately pass the ball or release it. That player must also get up or move away from it at once.
Sanction: Penalty kick

Didds, Do you mean the second sentence in bold? I'm sure you have seen not releasing pinged.

Why is it still in the law? The same reason will still have wisdom teeth. Evolution has leftovers. People in US do not need wisdom teeth because of fluoride in tap water and orthodontia have reduced the need. Very much a stereotype on my part, but other nations still need wisdom teeth.

 

[L'irlandais]

My view is that it is so fundamental they put it in the Law book twice.
[LAWS]‪15.7‬ Forbidden practices
(e) Danger may arise if a tackled player fails to release the ball or move away from it immediately, or if that player is prevented from so doing. If either of these happens the referee awards a penalty kick immediately[/LAWS]Didds, I am surprised a coach should ask the question. The law is there to safeguard the player's safety. Being off his feet he is out of the game. Since the game is about competing for the ball, the longer he remains near the ball while off his feet, the greater the risk of getting injured by arriving players. Or is your question about some other aspect of 15.5?
[LAWS]‪15.5‬ The tackled player
(b) A tackled player must immediately pass the ball or release it. That player must also get up or move away from it at once.
Sanction: Penalty kick

By the way LoTG provide 3 video examples of this being enforced.[/LAWS]

 

[Lee Lifeson-Peart]

15.5 The tackled player
(b)
A tackled player must immediately pass the ball or release it. That player must also get up or move away from it at once.
Sanction: Penalty kick

Didds, Do you mean the second sentence in bold? I'm sure you have seen not releasing pinged.

Why is it still in the law? The same reason will still have wisdom teeth. Evolution has leftovers. People in US do not need wisdom teeth because of fluoride in tap water and orthodontia have reduced the need. Very much a stereotype on my part, but other nations still need wisdom teeth.

There's something you don't see everyday - "people in the US" and "wisdom" in the same sentence. :biggrin:

 

[didds]

I see players pinged - correctly - for not releasing. But that's different from not moving away.

There are two parts to 15.5b The first sentence covers not releasing.
The second sentence is about what the tackled player must also do. And never does . Though it is occasionally suggested by some that a teammate grabbing the jersey prevents such an action and so a PK should be awarded. I don;t know if they have ever actually done that though.

I'm not actually bothered about it - everybody ignores it and nobody expects it to be blown. And the tackled player instead lightly controlling the ball helps cleaner ball (this doesn't mean not releasing it when having to!) .

But on that basis why keep it in the laws? Other than as suggested its so historical it just stays there, redundant but harmless.

I get the safety bit. But nobody ever gets pinged for laying there after being tackled and not getting away. Ever.

didds

 

[didds]

My view is that it is so fundamental they put it in the Law book twice.
[LAWS]‪15.7‬ Forbidden practices
(e) Danger may arise if a tackled player fails to release the ball or move away from it immediately, or if that player is prevented from so doing. If either of these happens the referee awards a penalty kick immediately[/LAWS]Didds, I am surprised a coach should ask the question. The law is there to safeguard the player's safety. Being off his feet he is out of the game. Since the game is about competing for the ball, the longer he remains near the ball while off his feet, the greater the risk of getting injured by arriving players. Or is your question about some other aspect of 15.5?
[LAWS]‪15.5‬ The tackled player
(b) A tackled player must immediately pass the ball or release it. That player must also get up or move away from it at once.
Sanction: Penalty kick

By the way LoTG provide 3 video examples of this being enforced.[/LAWS]

No it doesn't. All 3 videos demonstrate not releasing the ball. [1]

A tackled player must immediately pass the ball or release it

There are no examples for the tackled player not rolling away.

That player must also get up or move away from it at once.

Probably because there are NEVER any examples of penalising for

That player must also get up or move away from it at once.

You could take

That player must also get up or move away from it at once.

from law 15.5(b) and nothing would change.



didds
[1] Commentator uses the double movement explanation for video 2!

 

[Taff]

... Didds, Do you mean the second sentence in bold? I'm sure you have seen not releasing pinged.

Everyone has seen BCs pinged for not releasing, but none of the example videos (above) show a player pinged for not "getting up or move away from it at once."

My guess is that it's there to prevent BCs physically releasing, but then wrapping themselves around the ball (like in a foetal position) without actually touching it.

EDIT: Must learn to type faster than Didds. :redface:

 

[Pinky]

It may also not be pinged on grounds of immateriality? If the ball is put back into play pretty quickly (and this is what we want to happen) then whether the tackled palyer gets up or simply lies there (as long as they are not interfering with the ball or players) then so what?

 

[didds]

My guess is that it's there to prevent BCs physically releasing, but then wrapping themselves around the ball (like in a foetal position) without actually touching it.

I'd go with that ... except...

15.5 The tackled player
(a)
A tackled player must not lie on, over, or near the ball to prevent opponents from gaining possession of it, and must try to make the ball available immediately so that play can continue.

already covers that ?

didds

 

[didds]

It may also not be pinged on grounds of immateriality? If the ball is put back into play pretty quickly (and this is what we want to happen) then whether the tackled palyer gets up or simply lies there (as long as they are not interfering with the ball or players) then so what?

and its thus never been material in over 40 years?

not once. in the hundreds of games I must have seen?

maybe...

didds

 

[Not Kurt Weaver]

and its thus never been material in over 40 years?

not once. in the hundreds of games I must have seen?

maybe...

didds

There is a secondary signal for not rolling away. You have seen that. Isn't not rolling away using this law

 

[thepercy]

and its thus never been material in over 40 years?

not once. in the hundreds of games I must have seen?

maybe...

didds

I have pinged this, am I on my own here? When I have done so, it was in a counter-ruck situation, BC still laying there, about to be trampled, PK not rolling away. Or, when BC teammates bind on the BC, counter-ruck, and BC is dragged back towards the ball, PK not rolling away.

 

[Not Kurt Weaver]

There's something you don't see everyday - "people in the US" and "wisdom" in the same sentence. :biggrin:

LLP D.D.S., Ironically or wishfully, you used a emoticon with big white teeth. I knew my wisdom teeth analogy would fall flat on UK refs.

Congratulations are in order, the UK has recently overtaken Korea in # of dentists per capita, watch out Poland and Ukraine you are next.

Hey what do you call "wisdom teeth" in the UK. "Necessity teeth"?, "Two more years of grinding bacon teeth"? "16 yr molars" or "16yr teeth"?

FYI I'm playing on stereotypes, nothing personally

 

[didds]

The only time Ive seen the not rolling away secondary signal is the tackler not rolling away.

I can however see that thepercy's example would be fair and true here - except this presumably is already covererd by 15.5.a (see above)?

didds

 

[SimonSmith]

I have pinged this, am I on my own here? When I have done so, it was in a counter-ruck situation, BC still laying there, about to be trampled, PK not rolling away. Or, when BC teammates bind on the BC, counter-ruck, and BC is dragged back towards the ball, PK not rolling away.

You and I are in the same boat. Exactly the same circumstances in which I ping it.

 

[didds]

so what is 15.5a about then?

didds

 

[thepercy]

so what is 15.5a about then?

didds

So, you mean to say the LotG are imperfect, and redundant at times? Blasphemy!

 

[talbazar]

The only time Ive seen the not rolling away secondary signal is the tackler not rolling away.

I can however see that thepercy's example would be fair and true here - except this presumably is already covererd by 15.5.a (see above)?

didds

Didd's,
You're right 15.5.a and the second part of 15.5.b seem redundant. But are to me slightly different.
I would give the "Not rolling away" for 15.5.a. Not for b.

You're right, you'll never see this signal on TV for the kind of offence described by ThePercy. Or even for a "squeezed ball" (when the player is on his 4 with the ball under his belly).
Because it doesn't talk to anyone (Myth alert: only the tackler has to move away)

For ThePercy case (infringing 15.5.a IMHO), I used Option 1 once. Then I decided option 2 was just making all our life easier:
Option 1
- Blow the whistle
- Give secondary for not rolling away
- "But I'm the ball carrier sir!!!"
Option 2
- Blow the whistle
- Give secondary for not releasing
- Play continue

To me, we don't ping against that part of the law because players don't infringe this part of the law. Either they stick around and then "not release" "lie on", etc... Or they get back in play.

And if a tackled player stands up and just stays there: stop play get him out and get the medic to fully assess him for concussion before having someone bringing him home :biggrin:

 

[ChrisR]

Didds, I think that allowing the tackled player to not roll away is akin to letting the SH dig for the ball. Realistically the tackled player (TP) is most often quickly swamped by both support & ops so there is little chance of him getting out of there.

I've made the case in other threads that allowing the TP to be there creates an unfair obstacle to his ops. However, I'm not advocating for pinging the TP but for cutting the defender some slack when he's going for the ball.

 

[didds]

Oh I agree ChrisR I'm not advocationg that

* it should always be pinged, or
* i disagree with it.

Ive just never ever ever ever ever seen it blown, but tackled players never ever ever ever move awaay after relasing/passing the ball...

... so why have it.

I happily admit its a rhetorical/philosophical question.

Is a law that is never ever whistled on still a law?!

didds