where would you rather be tackled?

[Dickie E]

we've touched on this before.

where would you rather be tackled?
A. 1/2 metre short of the goal line, or
B. 1/2 metre over the goal line.

Correct answer: A.

B is incorrect because the tackler can keep you wrapped up and prevent a try. A is correct because tackler must release and you can reach out to ground the ball with impunity.

Funny game.

 

[TheBFG]

as a ref, I'd rather not be tackled at all

 

[OB..]

we've touched on this before.

So why are we going over it again?

where would you rather be tackled?
A. 1/2 metre short of the goal line, or
B. 1/2 metre over the goal line.

Correct answer: A.

B is incorrect because the tackler can keep you wrapped up and prevent a try. A is correct because tackler must release and you can reach out to ground the ball with impunity.

Funny game.

I assume it is a wrap tackle in both cases (otherwise you score in both).

Your argument is that the tackler must release first, thus allowing the ball carrier to reach out and score.

My point is that the law does not specify who should release first. Both have to act "immediately". It is a refereeing convention (not law) that we usually look at the tackler to release first. That normally makes sense of the game, but if the ball carrier can reach out to score, it is asking the tackler to commit hari-kiri, and is unreasonable.

IMHO once you decide there is no immediate possibility for the ball carrier to stretch out without being released first, you treat it as a Mexican stand-off and blow for a scrum.

 

[Browner]

......... treat it as a Mexican stand-off

http://www.google.co.uk/search?hl=e...B2015%2FE7O6VoRQyVl%2FMiguel%2BCarner;594;396

Miguel Carner ?

 

[Dickie E]

So why are we going over it again?

Sorry, I'll ask your permission next time [insert squiggly sarc thing here]

 

[OB..]

Sorry, I'll ask your permission next time [insert squiggly sarc thing here]

I was assuming you had some particular (unstated) reason to bring it up again.

 

[andyscott]

You cant have a tackle in goal

 

[Browner]

You cant have a tackle in goal

I'm presuming that historically ' grounding immediately' was a condition of crossing the Goal line. (OB?)

 

[OB..]

I'm presuming that historically ' grounding immediately' was a condition of crossing the Goal line. (OB?)

Rather the reverse. There wsa something called a "maul in goal". All those touching the ball when it crossed into in-goal were entitled to keep fighting for the ball. Once they lost contact, they had to move away. Such mauls could last for 10 minutes or more.

In 1892 it was abandoned and replaced by:-[LAWS]If the ball when over the goal line and in the possession of a player be fairly held by an opposing player before it is grounded, the ball shall be scrummaged five yards from the goal line opposite to the spot where the player was tackeld.[/LAWS](In those days being tackled did not mean "brought to ground"; it merely meant you were held so that you could not play the ball.

 

[andyscott]

You have to have a tackle in the field of play, the in goal is not in the field of play. Simples.

 

[Ian_Cook]

You have to have a tackle in the field of play, the in goal is not in the field of play. Simples.

noun or verb?

You can tackle (verb) a player anywhere in the playing enclosure, which includes in-goal

A tackle (noun) cannot take place in-goal.


There is a possible solution to this dilemma with a small Law change that only has effect near to the goal-line....

15.4 THE TACKLER
(a) When a player tackles an opponent and they both go to ground, the tackler must
immediately release the tackled player.
Sanction: Penalty kick
(b) The tackler must immediately get up or move away from the tackled player and from the
ball at once.
Sanction: Penalty kick
(c) The tackler must get up before playing the ball and then may play the ball from any
direction.
Sanction: Penalty kick

Exception
If the ball carrier is tackled and brought to ground within arm's reach of the opponent's goal-line such that he would be able to reach out and ground the ball in-goal to score a try, or, if the tackled player attempts to reach out and ground the ball in-goal to score a try, then the tackler does not have to release the tackled player, nor get up or move away before playing the ball.

thoughts....

 

[Dickie E]

You have to have a tackle in the field of play, the in goal is not in the field of play. Simples.

Dear Mr Simples. What do you call the action whereby a ball carrier is brought to ground in the in-goal by an opponent?

I'll assume, for the moment, that you are not being a tool. This assumption subject to revision without notice.

 

[Phil E]

Dear Mr Simples. What do you call the action whereby a ball carrier is brought to ground in the in-goal by an opponent?

I'll assume, for the moment, that you are not being a tool. This assumption subject to revision without notice.

I think you just answered it yourself. "Brought to ground".

 

[Dickie E]

I think you just answered it yourself. "Brought to ground".

we've touched on this before.

where would you rather be brought to ground?
A. 1/2 metre short of the goal line, or
B. 1/2 metre over the goal line.

Correct answer: A.

B is incorrect because the brought-to-grounder can keep you wrapped up and prevent a try. A is correct because brought-to-grounder must release and you can reach out to ground the ball with impunity.

Funny game.

FTFY. All happy now?

 

[andyscott]

I'll assume, for the moment, that you are not being a tool

Why would you ever assume that

 

[Dixie]

nThere is a possible solution to this dilemma with a small Law change that only has effect near to the goal-line....

15.4 THE TACKLER
(a) When a player tackles an opponent and they both go to ground, the tackler must
immediately release the tackled player.
Sanction: Penalty kick
(b) The tackler must immediately get up or move away from the tackled player and from the
ball at once.
Sanction: Penalty kick
(c) The tackler must get up before playing the ball and then may play the ball from any
direction.
Sanction: Penalty kick

Exception
If the ball carrier is tackled and brought to ground within arm's reach of the opponent's goal-line such that he would be able to reach out and ground the ball in-goal to score a try, or, if the tackled player attempts to reach out and ground the ball in-goal to score a try, then the tackler does not have to release the tackled player, nor get up or move away before playing the ball.

thoughts....

Mostly works for me - though I think I'd not extend the exception to cover playing the ball while on the ground. Just allow him to hold onto the tackled player, but make him try to get on his own side of the ball.

Remember that one reason for the law being as it is is to prevent mountain climbing. Allowing the defender to lurk on the wrong side is tantamount to condoning such mountaineering as the only available means of freeing up the ball to create a scoring opportunity.

 

[Browner]

Rather the reverse. There wsa something called a "maul in goal". All those touching the ball when it crossed into in-goal were entitled to keep fighting for the ball. Once they lost contact, they had to move away. Such mauls could last for 10 minutes or more.

In 1892 it was abandoned and replaced by:-[LAWS]If the ball when over the goal line and in the possession of a player be fairly held by an opposing player before it is grounded, the ball shall be scrummaged five yards from the goal line opposite to the spot where the player was tackeld.[/LAWS](In those days being tackled did not mean "brought to ground"; it merely meant you were held so that you could not play the ball.

I'd rather expected to hear that 'grounding immediately' had existed once , which woulve explained (and dovetailed rather nicely with) 15.1. It appears not.

Maybe if you can't be a ' tackler' in the in goal area, then you can't commit 'tackler' offences in there either!? which then means BC teammate can't be done for deliberately blocking the tackle attemptee either. Maybe this is a Canadian rugby interpretation (sarc) .... winks, ducks & heads for flak jacket shop :-D