ADVANTAGE WHEN TIME IS UP

[didds]

there's a significantly %age who will say that they had been told X phases for a scrum advantage and Y phases for a PK advantage.

ye gods

 

[Phil E]

Marc Wakeham said:
I give up. Thank god I don't referee or watch USA rugby.

are you as unpleasant in real life as you appear to be here?

You both need to stop now please.
Thanks
MOD

 

[Dickie E]

You both need to stop now please.
Thanks
MOD

does signing your post with MOD give you super powers? I'll need to give it a go

Thanks,
MOD

 

[Phil E]

does signing your post with MOD give you super powers? I'll need to give it a go

Thanks,
MOD

It just means it's a formal, but polite request....but then you knew that.

 

[Marc Wakeham]

I did 18 years in those trenches.

I'm far more challenged with my little groups in Alice. However, I went over the States as a B2 (I think). with very good law knowledge and a style where I didn't take BS.

As a result, my refereeing experience was easier, mentally, than RFU or Central Australia.

It was noticeable that referees who had done time abroad, or grown up playing abroad took a slightly different philosophical approach to the game. That is diminishing, but still there. A lot of the referee coaches I've interacted with try to issue mandates - stand here, stand there, do this, do that. With some limited exceptions very few are into problem solving, and enabling the referee to problem solve.

To go to Didd's statement about advantage...it's a recurrent theme with referees I coach. They play advantage in hope, and when asked "the non-offending team had no overlap, no size advantage, and no viable kick. When did you go back and forth across the pitch 2.5 times when they gained 2 meters?" there's a significantly %age who will say that they had been told X phases for a scrum advantage and Y phases for a PK advantage. They had an innate need for rules to referee by, and were challenged by the idea of exercising contextual judgment.

It sounds incredibly dull in the Sates, hence my comment. Referees need a feel for the game. Advantage is a big indicator of the quality of a referee. 10 metres is nonsense for a PK advantage.

 

[Marc Wakeham]

are you as unpleasant in real life as you appear to be here?

Oh dear. What a shame never mind! If someone thinks steadfastly that 10 metres is sufficient advantage for a PK then the game is in trouble. If it is intitutionlised across country. Then that country has problems. I'd want no part of its game.

Sorry that offends you flower.

 

[Dickie E]

Oh dear. What a shame never mind! If someone thinks steadfastly that 10 metres is sufficient advantage for a PK then the game is in trouble. If it is intitutionlised across country. Then that country has problems. I'd want no part of its game.

Sorry that offends you flower.

Pretty well answers my question.

 

[didds]

I like cheese

 

[jdeagro]

I like cheese

Me too mate, me too.

 

[jdeagro]

It just means it's a formal, but polite request....but then you knew that.

Advantage of the mod world...

 

[BikingBud]

What people do not like is referees who play an endless advantage when nothing is, really there, in the hope of an advantage appearing like magic.
trying to either keep the penalty count down or trying to look good.

The question to ask is "what is a REASONABLE expectation from a scrum / PK?" If the team gets that then it is advantage over. Tactical is far harder to assess.

But there were times in the England game at the weekend where I was screaming for the Ref to allow a little more, I felt he blew far too abruptly, especially when Smith came on and counter attacks in broken play were very real opportunities.

A little more empathy I think.

 

[Marc Wakeham]

But there were times in the England game at the weekend where I was screaming for the Ref to allow a little more, I felt he blew far too abruptly, especially when Smith came on and counter attacks in broken play were very real opportunities.

A little more empathy I think.

Of course it works both ways. How many times have you called "advantage over" only to see the pass not go to hand or you call "no advantage" and a massive gap appears like magic. All you want its the earth to swallow you up. I know I have.

 

[Volun-selected]

Very early on in my transition to the dark side, my ref assessor pointed out that for HS or lower college games - so the majority of my games - odds are they’re going to butcher any scrum advantage. So unless it’s clear and obvious in the first few seconds that they’re really making the opportunity work just blow the whistle and call them back for the scrum where (God willing) they won’t f*** it up.

Not sure I can or would formalize it - really is a case of I know it when I see it. (Though, as per @Marc Wakeham , I have blown the whistle just a moment before some kid bursts through for a break.

 

[Dickie E]

In the 66th minute in the Ireland NZ game. Ireland commit an offence in the scrum and NZ appear to get the ball out cleanly. WB awarded a penalty to NZ. I wonder why he didn't play advantage. As the scrum was just inside Ireland half maybe WB decided that an advantage equivalent to 3 points was very unlikely.

 

[Decorily]

In the 66th minute in the Ireland NZ game. Ireland commit an offence in the scrum and NZ appear to get the ball out cleanly. WB awarded a penalty to NZ. I wonder why he didn't play advantage. As the scrum was just inside Ireland half maybe WB decided that an advantage equivalent to 3 points was very unlikely.

Is this a leading question?

 

[RemainingInTheGame]

In the 66th minute in the Ireland NZ game. Ireland commit an offence in the scrum and NZ appear to get the ball out cleanly. WB awarded a penalty to NZ. I wonder why he didn't play advantage. As the scrum was just inside Ireland half maybe WB decided that an advantage equivalent to 3 points was very unlikely.

Savea did question Barnes (Taylor was also in bin so free play would also chew time) immediately after whistle.

Barnes apologised.

So good to see a human mistake acknowledged.

 

[crossref]

(Taylor was also in bin so free play would also chew time)

Time, and advantage, are very closely linked

 

[Dickie E]

Is this a leading question?

Not sure ... are you feeling led?

 

[Decorily]

Not sure ... are you feeling led?

As an Irish man I'm feeling more deflated than led today!

 

[Dickie E]

In the 66th minute in the Ireland NZ game. Ireland commit an offence in the scrum and NZ appear to get the ball out cleanly. WB awarded a penalty to NZ. I wonder why he didn't play advantage. As the scrum was just inside Ireland half maybe WB decided that an advantage equivalent to 3 points was very unlikely.

Similar. England v Fiji. 25th minute. Just inside England half so very kickable but try unlikely. No advantage played to Fiji.