coming through the middle

D

Decorily

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Ian_Cook said:
Technically: The ruck is over (ball out in SH hands) so whatever the player was bound into is not a ruck

Reality: It gets PK - "you can't play the SH".

So, what is the justification. Is the ex-rucker offside from the previous ruck?
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Hard to pin down exactly what the justification is other than that is the way we are Coached.
Crossref justifies it to allow a game break out which is probably good enough for me!!

Ian, could "You can't play the SH" be the new 'You have to let him up'?
 
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Steve70

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Does it make a difference if the ball is a foot behind the back foot of the ruck, and the 9 is weighing up his options before lifting? Is it justifiable for a counter-Rucker to fire through then and go for the ball?
 
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If the ball is clearly behind the back foot, the ruck is over and anyone who was onside at the end of it can go for the ball.
 
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Technically: The ruck is over (ball out in SH hands) so whatever the player was bound into is not a ruck

Reality: It gets PK - "you can't play the SH".

So, what is the justification. Is the ex-rucker offside from the previous ruck?
Click to expand...

Exactly the problem i'm trying to find out.
- as soon as #9 picks up the ball the ruck is over and he is fair game
- the opposing player that was bound in the ruck and came through the middle is waiting for the 9 to pick up the ball and
- as soon as 9 picks up the "player through the middle lets the binds go and tackles.

This is no good to continuity of play and in games where tere are mostly just 1 or 2 players from each team in chances for the ruckers to get trough are bigger so it's happening more and more.
Contest is still available by couterrucking or by the guards chasing the 9 as soon as he picks up.

Personally i'll penalise the tackler coming through the ruck in this case, but i haven't been able to find any laws to clearify!
 
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DocY


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Koen said:
Personally i'll penalise the tackler coming through the ruck in this case, but i haven't been able to find any laws to clearify!
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Watch his binding - IME when a player does this he's rarely binding, so not part of the ruck.
 
didds

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once the ruck is over he doesn;t have to bind though? Becasue there is no ruck to bind to?

all the more reason to ensure a ball winning player needs to bind to the oppo so that they cannot easily free themselves... another reason why "sealing off " (or whatever you may wish to call it) is not so great.

didds
 
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DocY


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didds said:
once the ruck is over he doesn;t have to bind though? Becasue there is no ruck to bind to?

all the more reason to ensure a ball winning player needs to bind to the oppo so that they cannot easily free themselves... another reason why "sealing off " (or whatever you may wish to call it) is not so great.

didds
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That's true, and if he can get through the middle of the former ruck to sack the scrum half between him picking the ball up and getting rid of it then good on him (or the scrum half was so slow he deserves what he gets). Personally, I'd go round the side.

I maybe misunderstood the situation, but the one I'm imagining, which comes up about once a match, is a player coming through the middle (not bound) while the ball is still in the ruck, then waiting until he's picked up the ball before jumping on him.
 
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That is indeed the situation i ment. It mostly comes up once or twice and stops directly after you penalise the first occasion.

My conclusion:
- scrumhalf should play quickly(choice or tactic), preventing players coming through tackling him (they wil have to unbind and get to him before they tackle anyway)
- if he is so slow they can legally get to him, thats his problem (or his teammates in the ruck not able to keep the counterruckers at bay) In this case ref might have called "use it" already
- players coming through must be bound until the #9 picks up (the oppsite usually occurs)
- players coming through while ball is still in are offside and must immediately move back without bothering the attacking team
 
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