Condescending Refereeing

BikingBud


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Was the referee in today's match between Eng and SA condescending by consistently referring to the players as boys?
 

chbg


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Due to his background I'm sure. Not the same, but we used to call our soldiers "The Boys". Absolutely not condescending (we relied on them!); other regiments used 'Jocks' etc. But the continual use today did sound grating to English ears.
 

crossref


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Due to his background I'm sure. Not the same, but we used to call our soldiers "The Boys". Absolutely not condescending (we relied on them!); other regiments used 'Jocks' etc. But the continual use today did sound grating to English ears.
Were you an officer ? Did you address the soldiers directly as "Boys" ?

Because that would be different from "the boys" in third person
 

Marc Wakeham


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Oft heard when you ask the captain to speak to his players... "Boys come in..." If often go for a beer with "the boys". I am struggling to know if the OP is serious.
 

crossref


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Oft heard when you ask the captain to speak to his players... "Boys come in..." If often go for a beer with "the boys". I am struggling to know if the OP is serious.
I don't think that is "oft heard".
On the contrary I think it is rare that a referee would address the players as "boys "

And not a good word to use
 
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Mipper


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He is Australian. Addressing the players as “boys” is what I would expect to be honest.

Would I do the same? Absolutely not, but that is because that is not my normal speech.

My ‘go to’ expression is “guys”. Do I care if anyone thinks this is condescending? Nope, this is how I speak in everyday conversation.
 

crossref


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"Guys" is indeed very different from "Boys" but if you did come to realise that you were using an inappropriate term in every day conversation.. then surely you'd just stop using it, right?


I don't see why him being Australian makes much difference, it's a global world now, AG is a young man operating on an international stage, being Australian is no excuse
 

Mipper


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"Guys" is indeed very different from "Boys" but if you did come to realise that you were using an inappropriate term in every day conversation.. then surely you'd just stop using it, right?


I don't see why him being Australian makes much difference, it's a global world now, AG is a young man operating on an international stage, being Australian is no excuse
I don’t actually see that an ‘excuse’ is required, as I don’t see that calling the players ‘boys’ is in any way an issue.

I work on an “international stage” and in all honesty one of the elements of this interaction is that people from different corners of the world use the English language in different ways, whether it is their first language or not. Another element is that I know that it is best not to become over pedantic with such minor differences.

so I understand your view on this ‘global world’ issue but I would point out that being part of the ‘global world’ is not the descent into being careful about the perception of honest words, but being honest when speaking, and understanding when listening.
 

crossref


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So I am confused by your post above where you said you would "absolutely not" address players as Boys , but for Australians it is what you would expect
 

Dickie E


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I don't particularly like gendered language that isn't relevant eg "ladies & gentlemen", "boys & girls", etc [aside: why does ladies come before gentlemen but boys before girls?]

If he'd used "lads" ... is that better? Lads isn't a very common word in Australia so that may sound more condescending & artificial. "Guys" sounds too American.

If a ref used "girls" in a womens' match ... OK or not?

If a female referee used "boys" in a men's match ... OK or not?

What is a better collective phrase ... "OK, you lot, scrum over here"?
 

crossref


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Do you need a collective phrase ?
Guys or Gentleman seems ok to me
"Everyone" might work
But the ref could say Ok, listen in ..

There are lots of alternatives that are better than "boys", or indeed "girls"
 

RemainingInTheGame


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I don't particularly like gendered language that isn't relevant eg "ladies & gentlemen", "boys & girls", etc [aside: why does ladies come before gentlemen but boys before girls?]

If he'd used "lads" ... is that better? Lads isn't a very common word in Australia so that may sound more condescending & artificial. "Guys" sounds too American.

If a ref used "girls" in a womens' match ... OK or not?

If a female referee used "boys" in a men's match ... OK or not?

What is a better collective phrase ... "OK, you lot, scrum over here"?
I've been trying to refer to them as "players" that way I'm including the juniors where we have mixed teams and also no need to change if I'm appointed to a women's match.

It's a bit clunky, so any better suggestions appreciated.

[Mixed success, especially with the juniors, where I'll refer to the forwards as 'boys' without thinking and then remember that the U12 tighthead who's been hitting the ball up brilliantly all day is a female - so I'll keep working on it]
 

Dickie E


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its back to the one syllable word issue. Red is better than Purple or Maroon. Set is better than Engage. Players, people ... how about "folk"?
 

SimonSmith


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To each their own, I guess. I call the players 'gents' or 'fellahs', or very occasionally 'mate', because that's how things are here. My other ref here usually "bro" liberally.

The players use "sir" "ref" "mate", and I don't care as long as they use the right tone and don't punch me.

The test is, does the communication have the desired effect or not? The vocabulary choice is important; I use the skipper's first name when things are going well, and when I use "Color/captain", he knows the brown stuff just impacted the ventilation device.
 

Phil E


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Lads and Ladettes ?
 
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