NZ vs IRL Test 3 - Andrew Porter‘s “absorbing tackle” on Brodie Retallick

Jarrod Burton said:
I really don't like that this tackle has been cited. It doesn't feel like RC foul play for mine. How does it compare to tackling a player in the air, tip tackles with a drop/drive, eye gouging, or even the two handed strike by Hill to Swains face in the first Aus Eng test (given that was not considered RC or citation worthy). A stand-up tackle, not driving through, with Retalick leading with his head into the contact - why is the ball carrier not responsible for preventing head contact too?
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I feel like you haven't been watching the last two years of elite rugby!
Players are frequently RC for incidents where they had no intention of comkitting foul play , but ended up causing head contact
 
Dixpat said:
Just because the head is forward of the torso in no way constitutes "leading with the head" (IMO)
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Appreciate what you are saying. ‘Running into a tackle with his head in front of his torso’ any better?
I wonder why a ball carrier doesn’t have a responsibility to avoid a tackler’s head with his head? Retallick clearly had plenty of time to observe where Porter’s head was or likely to be and avoid it by adjusting his arrival so he led with another part of his body.
We have a problem with foul play in the tackle because the ball carrier is allowed to do everything that is considered illegal by the tackler. I.E. lead with shoulder, push the tackler in the face (handoff) and even make contact with the tackler’s head with his head.
The above is just further frustration at what I said in earlier posts about being fed up of games being spoilt by too many players being sent off for unnecessary reasons. By all means card obvious cynical play and clear foul play but not things like bad timing or or a lack of awareness about what is going in because of a confusing situation in play. (Unless repeated which give a better indication of cynicism.) If I pay good money to watch a game I want to see as far as possible a fair contest between 15v15. Watching a game at the top level which is 15v15 throughout is now a rare event it seems to me.
 
crossref said:
I feel like you haven't been watching the last two years of elite rugby!
Players are frequently RC for incidents where they had no intention of comkitting foul play , but ended up causing head contact
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I don't get to watch much elite rugby - I won't give money to the (IMO morally bankrupt) Murdoch empire so I don't watch many games given RA is completely smitten with his $ to the exclusion of the grassroots community.
 
Balones said:
If I pay good money to watch a game I want to see as far as possible a fair contest between 15v15. Watching a game at the top level which is 15v15 throughout is now a rare event it seems to me.
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I have never subscribed to this view.

I do not recall a game I have seen that was spoiled by a sending off. I was at the recent Eng/Ire game and would include that.

I have though, seen many 15v15 games that were not fair.
 
"Having considered all the evidence, the independent committee applied World Rugby's Head Contact Process and agreed with the match officials' on-field decision that the player's act of foul play for a breach of Law 9.13 did not meet the red card threshold due to the absorbing nature of the tackle," a World Rugby statement read.
 
Balones said:
"Having considered all the evidence, the independent committee applied World Rugby's Head Contact Process and agreed with the match officials' on-field decision that the player's act of foul play for a breach of Law 9.13 did not meet the red card threshold due to the absorbing nature of the tackle," a World Rugby statement read.
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Good result. Never RC worthy IMO
 
Balones said:
I must admit to getting fed up with seeing games with fewer than 15v15. :)
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Whilst sympathising, this has to be a considered and risk/reward process by players and management etc. They've had plenty of opportunity now to adapt to body heights in the tackle yet continue to choose not do so. This has to be a deliberate choice. So the teams choose to possibly end up with cards in effect.
 
didds said:
Whilst sympathising, this has to be a considered and risk/reward process by players and management etc. They've had plenty of opportunity now to adapt to body heights in the tackle yet continue to choose not do so. This has to be a deliberate choice. So the teams choose to possibly end up with cards in effect.
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I have to admit that my ultimate comment was not specifically in relation to high tackles/foul play. It was a general comment about decisions made about technical offences as well. To me the recent games seemed to have too many ‘soft’ cards when a penalty would have sufficed. I do not condone cynical or dangerous/foul play. I just think that it is a debacle to have 15v12.
 
Balones said:
It was a general comment about decisions made about technical offences as well. To me the recent games seemed to have too many ‘soft’ cards when a penalty would have sufficed.
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Technical offences leading to 15v12? That would mean 3 double yellow would it not? Ican't recall any such situations.
 
Marc Wakeham said:
Technical offences leading to 15v12? That would mean 3 double yellow would it not? Ican't recall any such situations.
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No. I’m talking about such things as not rolling away/releasing. (L R-Z?) The debacle of 15v12 seems to suggest to me that the process/laws/refereeing are being applied in such a manner that are spoiling games. It may be understandable by knowledgeable people like ourselves but for the general supporter it’s something that’s putting them off the game as far as the feedback I am getting is concerned, and I have some sympathy for their position.
 
Right so temp suspensions not RCs . But surely if a side is giving three YC offences in quick succession why should they be protected by only getting one card? where as if they were spaced out they'd get the three?

The players are spoiling the game not the referees!
 
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wheras my perception is that once onbe YC is in the bin refs avoid awarding another that would otherwise have been an instant YC
 
Marc Wakeham said:
Right so temp suspensions not RCs . But surely if a side is giving three YC offences in quick succession why should they be protected by only getting one crd? where as if they were spaced out they'd get the three?

The players are spoiling the game not the referees!
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I think the referees are the least of the problem. They have to apply processes, laws and interpretations/guidance that are set by thise in hugh and are not allowed to think for themselves or apply common sense.
 
But the person who causes the card is the player (coach) so let's start THERE with who is "spoiling the game".
 
Marc Wakeham said:
But the person who causes the card is the player (coach) so let's start THERE with who is "spoiling the game".
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Agreed. My point is that I am generally fed up with games of ?v? Instead of 15v15. Everyone is to blame! Perhaps a player doesn’t mind going off for a ’rest’ so perhaps the answer is send him/her off permanently for a YC and miss the next week’s game will cure the player issue. But allow a team to replace the YCarded player. Players don’t like missing games. Just a thought.
Any other suggestions for ways we can keep the game 15v15 for spectators but appropriately sanction players and teams?
 
Referees are to blame when they don't isues the second card because "i've just put one in the bin". Players and coaches much change attitudes. Everything else stems from there.
 
Marc Wakeham said:
Referees are to blame when they don't isues the second card because "i've just put one in the bin". Players and coaches much change attitudes. Everything else stems from there.
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4 YCs in last 2 minutes of the game is my record. Multiple offences about 5m out finishing with a head high tackle in the act of scoring. Finished 17-16 in points and 15v11 in players. Shorthanded team won.

Spoke to winners' Captain in the bar afterwards who was convinced I wouldn't send more than one of them and he'd told them so when I told them to speak to his players :)

You can't educate pork!
 
Lee Lifeson-Peart said:
4 YCs in last 2 minutes of the game is my record. Multiple offences about 5m out finishing with a head high tackle in the act of scoring. Finished 17-16 in points and 15v11 in players. Shorthanded team won.

Spoke to winners' Captain in the bar afterwards who was convinced I wouldn't send more than one of them and he'd told them so when I told them to speak to his players :)

You can't educate pork!
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Hopefully he'll think on it and be better prepared next time. But you did all you could.
 
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