Players "faking" injuries : Any penalty for it?

[RugbyFan]

I have been a fan of international rugby since I was young, and try to watch every international game that I can. There is something about international games that make it such an interesting sport to watch.

Now my question to refs is, if a player is caught "faking" (for want of a better word) injury then is there any kind of rules which come into play?

For example, if we look at this footage it seems that the player dives onto the floor clutching his face when he had shoulder contact. A few moments (literally seconds) he is back up running around.
<iframe width="560" height="315" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/qaGkX6fFOXo" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

So I am interested if there is rules to prevent such items from affecting the sport because I would hate for this to become more widespread throughout the sport.

Thanks in advance!

BTW: Sorry if this is in the wrong forum, was not really sure where it should go because the video is from the RWC but it's a general Rugby question.

 

[Ciaran Trainor]

10.4.(m) Acts contrary to good sportsmanship. A player must not do anything that is against the spirit of good sportsmanship in the playing enclosure.
Sanction: Penalty kick

Which could be and should be a yellow card for faking it.

 

[crossref]

it seems to me that the main sanction in rugby is that when you are injured.... game carries on without you.
So there's not nearly so much incentive to fake an injury as there is is other sports. That usually works quite well.

the next feature that deters faking is that if the referee does stop the game, he also stops the clock - there is no timekeeper in the stands calculating minutes of injury time. So injuries aren't an effective way to waste time (there are other ways for that :wink: )

You certainly can't have referees judging which injuries are fake and which are real. They aren't doctors.

 

[RugbyFan]

Who would make the call on this? Just the Ref in play or can the Touch Judges advise the Ref in such incidents?

 

[RugbyFan]

it seems to me that the main sanction in rugby is that when you are injured.... game carries on without you.
So there's not nearly so much incentive to fake an injury as there is is other sports. That usually works quite well.

Which is probably why I have not noticed it before Just seemed a little odd in the situation above because it was very noticeable that something happened.

 

[crossref]

Who would make the call on this? Just the Ref in play or can the Touch Judges advise the Ref in such incidents?

Hi Rugbyfan -- it's a common misconception that TJs have any powers at all. In fact all they can do is judge posts and touch. The ref is prohibited from taking advice from TJs on any other issue.

an ASSISTANT REFEREE (an AR) is a different beast, he's an independtent official formally appointed by the IRB (or whoever).

the ref can consult an AR on most things, but normally he'll want advice on what he has seen/ not seen, ie what actually happened. He wouldn't (normally) ask if the AR whether he considered something unsportsmanlike or not. He's the ref, he makes the decisions.


It would be a very brave (foolhardy IMO) ref who decreed that an injury was not a real injury and penalised someone for it. What if it was real? How would he know? What if the player got back to his feet, and then collapsed two minutes later???

 

[Lee Lifeson-Peart]

Your video seems to show VC getting a clip then when there's no PK coming he gets up and carries on. Have I missed something?

 

[RugbyFan]

Hi Rugbyfan -- it's a common misconception that TJs have any powers at all. In fact all they can do is judge posts and touch. The ref is prohibited from taking advice from TJs on any other issue.

Thanks! Good to know

It would be a very brave (foolhardy IMO) ref who decreed that an injury was not a real injury and penalised someone for it. What if it was real? How would he know? What if the player got back to his feet, and then collapsed two minutes later???

Yes, I agree that in some cases it would be hard to tell.

Your video seems to show VC getting a clip then when there's no PK coming he gets up and carries on. Have I missed something?

What I saw was Blue14 collecting the ball, kicking it and then you see a Red shirt make shoulder contact. Blue14 falls to the floor and is clutching his face with his hands. Camera pans right, pans back left and Blue14 is stood up running (could be walking) towards ball. It's less clear on the YouTube video, but it certainly shows up on the recorded footage I have on the TV. I rewound at the time because I saw the player drop as it happened and thought something more serious had actually happened.

 

[PaulDG]

What I saw was Blue14 collecting the ball, kicking it and then you see a Red shirt make shoulder contact. Blue14 falls to the floor and is clutching his face with his hands. Camera pans right, pans back left and Blue14 is stood up running (could be walking) towards ball. It's less clear on the YouTube video, but it certainly shows up on the recorded footage I have on the TV. I rewound at the time because I saw the player drop as it happened and thought something more serious had actually happened.

The commentary is unclear in the clip but I have the impression there was a penalty for offside coming. I imagine the ref either didn't see the theatrics or saw them and decided that if a French player wanted to have a little lie down on the pitch that was his problem.

We all agree though that this sort of behaviour should be removed from the game. While a referee can't judge that an injury hasn't happened, in this case the post-"incident" behaviour was pretty clear cut and I'd have been considering a penalty or reversing a penalty for it in a community game.

Not easy to do on TV though.

 

[Robert Burns]

I have been a fan of international rugby since I was young, and try to watch every international game that I can. There is something about international games that make it such an interesting sport to watch.

Now my question to refs is, if a player is caught "faking" (for want of a better word) injury then is there any kind of rules which come into play?

For example, if we look at this footage it seems that the player dives onto the floor clutching his face when he had shoulder contact. A few moments (literally seconds) he is back up running around.

So I am interested if there is rules to prevent such items from affecting the sport because I would hate for this to become more widespread throughout the sport.

Thanks in advance!

BTW: Sorry if this is in the wrong forum, was not really sure where it should go because the video is from the RWC but it's a general Rugby question.

I raise your Clerc and give you Lee Byrne in the Scotland v Wales game when he fell down like a sniper had shot him, which got the Scotland player sin-binned and won Wales a game that they didn't deserve to win (Sound familiar?). (Please also note I never blamed the ref for one second) but yes, cheating gits is a horrible part of professional sport and if I saw it was obvious I would penalise and possibly even offer the same sanction that the cheating player was trying to achieve for the other team.

 

[The umpire]

and now we have gatland admitting that they considered doing just that because they felt hard done by the ref.s call

 

[Lee Lifeson-Peart]

Why is "man off" not applied to Internationals?

Is it just in RFU land?

 

[Davet]

The man off laws are delegated to each union to either apply or not as they see fit.

The IRB, which has charge of internationals, has clearly decided not to take itself up on its own offer.

 

[Agustin]

Why is "man off" not applied to Internationals?

Is it just in RFU land?

What is "man off"?

 

[crossref]

What is "man off"?

if the player leaving the pitch causes uncontested scrums then no replacement is allowed, reducing the team to 14.

widely played in the UK ... and elsewhere.

 

[RugbyFan]

I raise your Clerc and give you Lee Byrne in the Scotland v Wales game when he fell down like a sniper had shot him, which got the Scotland player sin-binned and won Wales a game that they didn't deserve to win (Sound familiar?). (Please also note I never blamed the ref for one second) but yes, cheating gits is a horrible part of professional sport and if I saw it was obvious I would penalise and possibly even offer the same sanction that the cheating player was trying to achieve for the other team.

I do not remember that, but yeah if it was obvious then he should have been penalised also. I think the game is getting a wider audience, and with that come more money as a positive but the negative aspect is increased cheating. Hopefully it does not become more serious. It's one of the main reasons I never watch football, not even internationals.

 

[RugbyFan]

and now we have gatland admitting that they considered doing just that because they felt hard done by the ref.s call

Gatland is generally an honest man and is not someone who I would expect to say something controversial. I suspect he was trying to get a point over but it came out completely the wrong way, such as being able to use the existing rules to the letter (Yes, by cheating) to get a stronger position in the game and who would be able to tell? Morally it is wrong and thankfully he chose not to do that. The question is then "How many similar conversations are happening in the sport?" and the answer could be worrying.

 

[Waspsfan]

The problem with Gatland's 'honesty' is the amount of times Wasps had uncontested scrims under his command and how dodgy that now looks. How does one know if 'man off' applies in their jurisdiction? Personally I have never applied it. If we go uncontested then so be it - I leave it for the league to sort out. Is this wrong?

 

[SimonSmith]

I raise your Clerc and give you Lee Byrne in the Scotland v Wales game when he fell down like a sniper had shot him, which got the Scotland player sin-binned and won Wales a game that they didn't deserve to win (Sound familiar?). (Please also note I never blamed the ref for one second) but yes, cheating gits is a horrible part of professional sport and if I saw it was obvious I would penalise and possibly even offer the same sanction that the cheating player was trying to achieve for the other team.

Phil Godman. And ever since then I wouldn't piss on Byrne if he was on fire. **** of a player.

 

[Ian_Cook]

I have been a fan of international rugby since I was young, and try to watch every international game that I can. There is something about international games that make it such an interesting sport to watch.

Now my question to refs is, if a player is caught "faking" (for want of a better word) injury then is there any kind of rules which come into play?

For example, if we look at this footage it seems that the player dives onto the floor clutching his face when he had shoulder contact. A few moments (literally seconds) he is back up running around.
<iframe src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/qaGkX6fFOXo" allowfullscreen="" frameborder="0" height="315" width="560"></iframe>

So I am interested if there is rules to prevent such items from affecting the sport because I would hate for this to become more widespread throughout the sport.

Thanks in advance!

BTW: Sorry if this is in the wrong forum, was not really sure where it should go because the video is from the RWC but it's a general Rugby question.

If you click HERE you should be able to find the answer you are looking for!