Red and Yellow Cards

[Robert Burns]

What do you use?

The supplied round red and tiny square yellow?
The football rectangle red and yellow?

A different type?


Any reason for preference?

Assessors, any reasoning for yourself for using a particular type.


I use the football ones that sit in my score book, the disadvantage (to some sort) is that when I give cards I give the chat to the captain and they see what I am pulling from my book.

More and more I believe it would be better (but I can't justify why, apart from I see the top guys doing it) if I used the square and round in my pocket and pulled the card out I wanted, they can't see what it is till it's shown.

You obviously know what it is from the shape.

 

[Bryan]

I use the football ones that sit in my score book, the disadvantage (to some sort) is that when I give cards I give the chat to the captain and they see what I am pulling from my book.

Why is it so bad if the captain and offending player can see what's coming? This isn't a magic show! Pardon my candour, but if referees don't have the balls to pull it out in front of the captain (the cards, that is) then that's a bigger issue. I'll normally tell them even as I'm pulling one out (once again, I refer to the card here) and maybe before, so it's along the lines of "Serious act of foul play- dangerous tackle- you're in the bin" then pull it out. I feel the cards are for the spectators and the other referees on the touchline more than the player you're addressing.

I use the soccer ones like you Robert, and I enjoy them as it keeps them well contained in a neat little pack in my pocket, where I can also keep the scorecard and fold it so it doesn't get wet if it's raining.

I'm still puzzled as to the rationale for keeping them hidden until the last moment- no need to fumble in your pocket to feel for the right shape- it just delays the process.

-Bryan

 

[jboulet4648]

How about my favorite I heard a few years back when a ref red carded someone.....he said "you sir are the weakest link.....goodbye!"

I think it was a Gloucester ref on exchange.....

 

[Simon Thomas]

memorable comment I once got after a full-blooded haymaker caused the receiving player's nose to explode was

sorry sir, red is the colour I know, number 7, John Smith, and what would you like to drink afterwards sir. The orange-lemonade was waiting for me !
On his way he apologised to the player he had hit, but commented - 'never grab my bollocks like that again'.

 

[ex-lucy]

is it wrong to not show cards then? .... i prefer not to ... i prefer to ask the captain to ask the player to spend 10 mins behind the posts....
I talk to the captain but ensure the player is aware of what i am saying ... and tell him that i asked him in the pre-match brief to control his players (and consequentally), so he has now left me no choice to increase sanctions on one of his players ...
but i believe that yellow/ red cards are not necessary when dealing with grown ups and juniors ...
am i wrong ?
again, is this a level thing ?
Mike?

 

[Simon Thomas]

ex Lucy - you should always show yellow and red cards at all levels - and not just to the player but in an extended vertical arm so all can see.

It avoids any doubt what-so-ever about your decision for the player involved, the skipper, the other players, coaches, spectators etc.

And in the case of a red card it is vital as at a subsequent disciplinary hearing a player pleading not guilty could get off if you didn't show him and all others a red card - same principle as incorrect police arrest / evidence gathering processes leading to aquittal.

 

[Simon Griffiths]

I agree that a card must be shown - but for a less administrational reason, simply as Simon T says, so that all of the other players (I couldn't care less about the spactators in the grand scheme of things) know what action you've taken - it's a form of warning to the others. I also think you should be talking to the transgressor with the captain there to know what's going on, not the other way round - any other views on this?

As far as cards go, we're issued with two rectangular ones round here. I used to put my yellow in my right hand pocket (used more often) and the red in the left hand pocket (this was brought in after looking like a prat - I told the player he was in the bin and then fumbled in the pocket and brought out a red card . Hence I started keeping them in different pockets). I now have one of these books which have one in a little pocket on each side, it also houses my score card, leaving the other pocket in my shorts free for my spare whistle.

 

[ex-lucy]

i guess i am loathe to show cards to players i know and recently played against .....if i was on exchange or involved with players i didnt know, i guess, i might be more strict in this application.
But with Juniors (e.g. U14s) also ?
One thing i really hate is the soccer mentality creaping in with the chant of "off, off, off" when it looks like a player is about to be binned... and i dont like the fuelling of this with a showmanship like flourish of a card ... or is this just me and my age ?

talking to captain rather than player ... i picked this bit of advice up form this forum on another thread ...

 

[Simon Thomas]

ex-Lucy - why is it a 'showmanship like flourish of a card'. It is common practice - talk to player and skipper (90% of time they know what is coming), then card out and straight up in vertical arm / hand.
as for players you used to play with, you have to be objective AND consistent about it - just because you know someone doesn't mean you can't yellow/red card them.
It works the other way around too - few seasons ago I had a Vets side on team warning for deliberate hands in ruck, next ruck out the ball popped 'wrong side' - I know who it was (an old team-mate), and he owned up afterwards, but he know I couldn't see it. To give it, you have to see it.

Simon G - when you have been to a few contested Disciplinary Committees and seen "guilty as hell" players get off with 'legal' technicalities, then you will understand the admin reasons are just as important. Also never discount spectators - especially when there are a few of them !

 

[Simon Griffiths]

Simon, I didn't mean that to come out as admin reasons are inconsequential . I agree that we have to keep everything covered (lest it come back to cause huge problems), but I was talking from an on-field, in match management view-point.

Also, as far as spectators go, I did add 'in the grand scheme of things'. Having refereed a few games in-front of 'packed houses' (including the infamous Lydney colts match) I know how important it is to keep in excess of 500 supporters off your back - especially ones from the Forest!

 

[Robert Burns]

Why is it so bad if the captain and offending player can see what's coming? This isn't a magic show! Pardon my candour, but if referees don't have the balls to pull it out in front of the captain (the cards, that is) then that's a bigger issue. I'll normally tell them even as I'm pulling one out (once again, I refer to the card here) and maybe before, so it's along the lines of "Serious act of foul play- dangerous tackle- you're in the bin" then pull it out. I feel the cards are for the spectators and the other referees on the touchline more than the player you're addressing.

I use the soccer ones like you Robert, and I enjoy them as it keeps them well contained in a neat little pack in my pocket, where I can also keep the scorecard and fold it so it doesn't get wet if it's raining.

I'm still puzzled as to the rationale for keeping them hidden until the last moment- no need to fumble in your pocket to feel for the right shape- it just delays the process.

-Bryan

Bryan,

I agree, I have no idea why the captains shouldn't know what I am bringing out, however I notice none of the top refs use this system and was wondering if it is because you can tell what the card is, instead of reaching into the pocket and just showing it.

Anyone know why, anyone ask a top ref? (If Roy Maybank, Barnesy or Dave Broadwell is at our meeting on Tusday I'll ask then)

 

[ex-lucy]

very interesting .... i watched the first 10/15 mins of 1st xv Cup match on nrby pitch .. Level 4/5, ref i know quite well....(he is reffing Darlington next week in national leagues)... he allowed me to be with him at prematch briefs etc ... then i did mine and studs etc ... then i watched his first 10/15 mins ...

card incident ....
green attacking down right wing ... into blue 22.
green winger rcvs ball and blue 7 'tackles' him high and dangerously without arms... just using shoulder .. basically shoulder charges him (right nr touch line).

Ref sees it.
Blows his whistle good and hard.
takes a breath.
seperates players.
tends to injured player.
takes a breath.
a good 30/45 secs from the start of the incidient he beckons 7 and captain over and backtracks towards centre of pitch.
cant hear what he is saying but from his actions he is describing what he saw and he is asking 7 to keep quiet.
next he brings out yellow card and lifts it head height (not above head) towards blue 7 and the blue team.
I dont think neither green team nor spectators get a good look at it but they see blue 7 trudging towards side line.
There is no doubt as to what just happened. But the card was not brandished just shown.

i was stood next to his advisor who said "excellently handled" ...
advisor told me this guy is going places and is a good role model.

 

[robertti]

This really shouldn't be that much of a picky issue. We don't have to be pedantic about the whole put it over your head thing. As long as a card is shown reasonably clearly, its fine.

 

[Robert Burns]

lol,

Not meant to be picky, just wondering what method people prefer?

 

[tim White]

I have had a problem when without cards that some people on, and off, the pitch were uncertain wether I had binned or sent off a player. I now carry the cards for communicating this clearly, I treat it as an additional signal - surely that is all it is.
out of interest I have rectangular cards that fit within my note book but it is always tricky getting them out when required, and perhaps its better that way.

 

[Wert Twacky]

I use rectangular shaped cards and keep them both in my left pocket. I always put the yellow one at the front so I know when I delve in which one I am going to pull out.

I have absolutely no qualms about using either and normally tell the offender what he did, explain why he can't do it and issue my sanction:

"Ruck was formed, you came in at the side and killed the play. It's 10 minutes in the bin," etc. I then show the card above the head and to the side, so as not to stick it straight in the guy's face - bit officious (can't spell).

I have found it very useful to go over in my head (while no-one's looking for fear of being locked up with the fairies) what I would say at given situations so as not to get toungue tied, ramble etc. I have found this very rewarding needless to say!

 

[ex-lucy]

werttwacky .... about how many spectators do you get for one of your matches ?

would you be diff in your showing of cards if there were no spectators ?

 

[Deeps]

I will tell the skipper and miscreant what I saw and what the consequences are before I show a card. I communicate by voice to these two, the cards are for the remaining players, spectators and other animals.

What I do find embarrassing though is not being able to get my referee's wallet with the cards out of my short's pocket in a hurry, I usually have that peaceful moment when the kicker is teeing up the conversion kick to do that, and on a couple of occasions the offending player has long left the field while I am still wrestling with my shorts.