[INTERNATIONAL] Sonny Bill Williams/Sinny Bin Williams

[Pegleg]

Because he is an ex leaguie and under pressure his instincts kicked in.

After 40+ caps?

 

[OB..]

Beam me up. Is that, pretend he wasn't there?

That he infringed is not under question.

Surely that is all that matters? Why should we have to consider what he might have done instead? That is all that "beam me up, Scotty" means.

if you compare against the application of the high tackle protocols, it might be better to scribe in the laws that if the player should have reasonably known that his action might prevent a try then it might serve as a clearer warning and perhaps a better deterrent.

Why complicate the issue by asking the referee to decide what the player thought? What matters is what he did, and that is enough for the referee to have to judge

 

[Lindsay G]

I find it hard to imagine that NZ players on the pitch were disappointed with decision. If it had a been a game I was reffing it seems like an incident that might might well prompt some discussion in the bar afterwards, because it was unusual, but on pitch I think the players would have accepted a PT quite easily, and with a PT it's always a card

It was Scrum penalty at 54 minutes, or 110 on the coverage I have to hand. Took place right in front of AG but I think he was watching himself on the big screen and missed it.

 

[ChuckieB]

Surely that is all that matters? Why should we have to consider what he might have done instead? That is all that "beam me up, Scotty" means.
Why complicate the issue by asking the referee to decide what the player thought? What matters is what he did, and that is enough for the referee to have to judge

Looking to shift the burden of responsibility even more onto the player and away from a judgement call by the ref.

"SBW you should have reasonably known that the action might prevent a try from being scored. That I don't have to consider whether the opposing player would have probably scored..... "just shifts the emphasis marginally and we can all say, what a silly thing to do, not spend time wondering whether it was a probable try. As some have said, the player might have not been well placed to ground the ball.

 

[crossref]

Here's the inadvertent PK --

https://youtu.be/YV5cFrdwPBM?t=4265


that's an interesting one !

I think AG made the right call, but for the wrong reason. Best just to say 'a PK can't happen accidentally'

Note that AB's didn't really believe in it either, otherwise they'd have flattened him.

 

[Ian_Cook]

Looking to shift the burden of responsibility even more onto the player and away from a judgement call by the ref.

"SBW you should have reasonably known that the action might prevent a try from being scored. That I don't have to consider whether the opposing player would have probably scored..... "just shifts the emphasis marginally and we can all say, what a silly thing to do, not spend time wondering whether it was a probable try. As some have said, the player might have not been well placed to ground the ball.

That is all the referee has to judge, and if you listen to what Angus Gardner actually said...

"I believe the ball would have landed in the French player's hands but for the slap down by (black) No 12, so its going to be a penalty try"

...you would realise that this can no longer be speculated upon. You might disagree with his opinion, but you cannot disagree with his awarding of a PT based on what HE has said his thinking is.

 

[Pegleg]

It was Scrum penalty at 54 minutes, or 110 on the coverage I have to hand. Took place right in front of AG but I think he was watching himself on the big screen and missed it.

Terrible post!

 

[ChuckieB]

That is all the referee has to judge, and if you listen to what Angus Gardner actually said...

"I believe the ball would have landed in the French player's hands but for the slap down by (black) No 12, so its going to be a penalty try"

...you would realise that this can no longer be speculated upon. You might disagree with his opinion, but you cannot disagree with his awarding of a PT based on what HE has said his thinking is.

Not disputing his award of the PT & no problem with his thought process and the outcome as he saw it. I am just exploring the opportunity to amend a process to make it less reliant on the judgement from a ref's perspective and assign more direct accountability to the player which might just have prevented his brain fade.

"if you you don't think you are going to like the outcome, don't make the attempt." is all I'm saying.

 

[damo]

After 40+ caps?

What's your explanation then?

 

[Pegleg]

I don't have one. That is why I ask the question. I just don't buy a 40+ cap player should be making that sort of error.

 

[didds]

What's your explanation then?

He's a pillock?

didds

 

[crossref]

Well if he did it cynically he certainly deserved the YC and PT

 

[Ian_Cook]

I don't have one. That is why I ask the question. I just don't buy a 40+ cap player should be making that sort of error.

Players often do things reactively or instinctively, for example, sticking an arm out and coat-hangering a player who has just stepped them. I've seen players do that when they have been playing the game for their whole lives.... ask yourself why players like Dylan Hartley keep getting YC/RC and suspended?

 

[Pegleg]

Players often do things reactively or instinctively, for example, sticking an arm out and coat-hangering a player who has just stepped them. I've seen players do that when they have been playing the game for their whole lives.... ask yourself why players like Dylan Hartley keep getting YC/RC and suspended?

Agreed but that is nothing to do with RL. That is instict to stop / prevent something.

 

[SimonSmith]

Players often do things reactively or instinctively, for example, sticking an arm out and coat-hangering a player who has just stepped them. I've seen players do that when they have been playing the game for their whole lives.... ask yourself why players like Dylan Hartley keep getting YC/RC and suspended?

Because he's an asshole?

 

[crossref]

the reference to RL is because -- (I assume!) -- SBW action would be legal in Rugby League, and the incident shows that he has RL instincts.

 

[Pegleg]

the reference to RL is because -- (I assume!) -- SBW action would be legal in Rugby League, and the incident shows that he has RL instincts.

Yes I know. However, as a 40+ capped RU international surely it is time his RU instincts kicked in.

 

[didds]

Yes I know. However, as a 40+ capped RU international surely it is time his RU instincts kicked in.

agreed ( as opined previously).

He manages to suppress his boxing instincts it seems.

didds

 

[Pegleg]

agreed ( as opined previously).

He manages to suppress his boxing instincts it seems.

didds

Good point.

 

[dickell]

deja vu all over again for AG:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WCOIOTKy78M

Not sure why this wasn't a PT

IF it was suggested to AG in the debrief that this should have been a PT, that may have influenced his thinking in the SBW incident.