WB shows YC for swearing

[Jarrod Burton]

Video - Wayne Barnes sends Wallaby hooker off for swearing

Stade Francais hooker Tolu Latu was sent off after receiving his second yellow card for swearing at referee Wayne Barnes.

www.rugbypass.com

Not sure how I feel about this if it happened like WB claims - intitially Latu "looked straight at me and shouted, ‘f**king hell!” then immediately after when the captain claimed he was speaking French WB said "Stop. He then looked at me and said ‘I got the f***ing ball. Very much happy…yellow card, red card.”

There's a big difference between being abused and a player swearing when angry. Maybe its one of those things that varies between referee's. I'd happily card a player for swearing about me (ie you f*cking dick or cheat) or if I'd warned them about dissent but to go to the pocket straight away seems like a snap hot-headed reaction rather than a considered approach. Those snap cards always make me feel like the referee has lost control of themselves a bit.

Happy for reasonable discussion about what your thoughts are.

 

[crossref]

WB explained it pretty well - he felt that Latu was swearing AT him

 

[Dickie E]

I'm with Jarrod. An over-reaction by Mr Barnes. Wasn't abuse & marginal dissent. Might be worth a 10m march but not a card.

I wonder if tension had been high throughout the game

 

[Zebra1922]

I’m with Mr B - unacceptable to be swearing at the referee. Even if it is not abuse at the referee, swearing loudly in the way described is a YC in my book.

And going back to another reply, if a player said something like “you effing dick“ at me they’re getting a RC.

 

[crossref]

As an aside, TV rugby has a massive swearing problem at the moment (IMO) I don't want to have regular F words audible from my TV all Sunday afternoon, as was the case yesterday

That is not chiefly one for referees, the sport has to decide the standard here (refs can enforce)

 

[Ciaran Trainor]

The player didn't even look surprised, he knew what he said

 

[Phil E]

The player said "F'in hell".
Wayne then started to say to him "speak like that again..." so he was trying to manage it.
At which point the player looked straight at Barnsey and said "I got the f'in ball", that is dissenting the referees decision, clear as day, and deserved a Yellow Card.

As for the Captain saying "he spoke in French, maybe you didn't understand", maybe he needs to understand that his player is Australian and didn't speak in French...and that Barnsey speaks French

However the best bit was the commentary "Good Night, Good Luck and Good Bye" ??

 

[Dickie E]

Well, in 2022 the f word is a common & accepted adjective. Except maybe at the vicar's morning tea.

If he'd said "flipping hell" or "bleeding hell" would Barnes have got all bent out of shape?

 

[didds]

I’m with Mr B - unacceptable to be swearing at the referee. Even if it is not abuse at the referee, swearing loudly in the way described is a YC in my book.

And going back to another reply, if a player said something like “you effing dick“ at me they’re getting a RC.

indeed.

If you dont want to be accidentally RCd for NOT swearing AT the ref... dont swear in earshot of the ref. Simples!

 

[RedCapRef]

As someone brought up in England and now living in Australia, there is a very big cultural difference with swearing and what is seen as acceptable, both in society and in sport.
If that had happened in Australia with an Australian ref I suspect that it would not have been enforced in the same way, but in England most refs would have given the same decision. As in all aspects of life it is the culture of where you are and not where you come from that is enforced. Witness the current discussions around the crowd behaviour at the Australian open tennis with some foreign media incensed and local media loving it.

 

[Jarrod Burton]

As in all aspects of life it is the culture of where you are and not where you come from that is enforced. Witness the current discussions around the crowd behaviour at the Australian open tennis with some foreign media incensed and local media loving it.

Probably cause the Australian media is majority run by a bloke who thinks its ok to tap peoples phones and permits the publishing of misogynistic rubbish against our female prime minister presumably because she doesn't share enough taxpayers money with him.

 

[Jarrod Burton]

As someone brought up in England and now living in Australia, there is a very big cultural difference with swearing and what is seen as acceptable, both in society and in sport.
If that had happened in Australia with an Australian ref I suspect that it would not have been enforced in the same way, but in England most refs would have given the same decision. As in all aspects of life it is the culture of where you are and not where you come from that is enforced. Witness the current discussions around the crowd behaviour at the Australian open tennis with some foreign media incensed and local media loving it.

I think you and Dickie have hit the nail on the head here. Australian's (including me) swear more than most countries including the F word as an adjective, noun, and adverb. But as an international level referee I'd be expecting somewhat of a calmer head from WB - if a player is in the middle of a blow up ripping a card out and taking a very arrogant approach isn't going to defuse the situation, especially in the weeds.

 

[Dickie E]

As in all aspects of life it is the culture of where you are and not where you come from that is enforced.

that sounds non-inclusive, non-diverse and somewhat racist to me

 

[Jz558]

I hear the F word many times during games but the context of use is important. In this instance if i was in the process of warning a player about them questionning my decisions, and they continued to do so, whether they used the F word wouldn't particularly bother me.

That said I think Barnes could have acted less hastily in this instance but I guess we dont know what was said previously and whether this was a one off blow up or had a more gradual build up.

 

[Marc Wakeham]

Well, in 2022 the f word is a common & accepted adjective.

I guess that depends on an individuals standards.

 

[chbg]

I think you and Dickie have hit the nail on the head here. Australian's (including me) swear more than most countries including the F word as an adjective, noun, and adverb. But as an international level referee I'd be expecting somewhat of a calmer head from WB - if a player is in the middle of a blow up ripping a card out and taking a very arrogant approach isn't going to defuse the situation, especially in the weeds.

WB only awarded a YC for the swearing infringement. It is not his fault that the player had already received a YC, nor should that change how he should have reacted to the swearing. Both were clear examples of Foul Play. (It may temper to whom you award a 'team' YC, if you can.)

 

[Flish]

If I told a player to stop swearing and then he immediately swore in response, arguably *at* me then he’s getting a card, could easily be a straight red

 

[RedCapRef]

that sounds non-inclusive, non-diverse and somewhat racist to me

Why?

If you are in the middle east the laws and culture around drinking are enforced for there not where you come from. Nothing to do with racism, diversity or inclusion.

 

[Jarrod Burton]

Why?

If you are in the middle east the laws and culture around drinking are enforced for there not where you come from. Nothing to do with racism, diversity or inclusion.

While I understand what you are trying to argue - the logical conclusion of that argument could result in the IRB applying international match law variations depending upon the location of an match based on local culture and who the referee is. Too many fans already complain about the wide variability in refereeing as it is.

 

[Dickie E]

Why?

If you are in the middle east the laws and culture around drinking are enforced for there not where you come from. Nothing to do with racism, diversity or inclusion.

in the Middle East they throw homosexuals off the roofs of buildings and circumcise girls. Just because they are cultural norms doesn't make them defendable.