When are the Elite going to call use it IAW the laws?

Ciaran Trainor


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I thought they were looking to speed up the elite game?
Scrums and lines out don't seem much different and if anything, the elite refs are making the breakdown longer!
All three six nations games had multiple rucks where the ball was clearly available yet the refs only call use it when the half back eventually gets the ball to the back of the quickly formed caterpillar. Very poor from our "elite" officials.
 
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crossref


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When the ball has been clearly won by a team at the ruck, and is available to be played, the referee calls “use it”, after which the ball must be played away from the ruck within five seconds. Sanction: Scrum.

The Law is basically too slow.
 

Stu10


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One thing that caught my eye at the rucks was players making a caterpillar with a very long body shape and a hand or knee on the floor as support... not good!
 

Stu10


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What does IAW mean?
 

Phil E


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Bit of both I think. The Law has no urgency, and the refs don't apply it

Yes and No.

Elite refs wait until the ball is right at the back and easily accessible before telling them to use it.
I habitually start counting when they say use it and the ball is usually kicked around 4 to 4 and a half seconds later.

The difference between elite and grass roots is the definition of when the ball is available...not the 5 seconds.
 

crossref


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Yes, but the 5 sec is very long , so refs can never really create quick ball even when they call an early use it
I think that every other instruction a ref issues the expectation is to respond immediately, or without delay
 

Phil E


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Yes, but the 5 sec is very long , so refs can never really create quick ball even when they call an early use it
I think that every other instruction a ref issues the expectation is to respond immediately, or without delay

But that's not the referees fault. 5 seconds is 5 seconds long.
I get that some people think the law should be changed to less than 5 seconds (that's another discussion all together), but you can't say the referees aren't applying the law (the OP) unless they allow more than 5 seconds from when they say use it, which isn't my experience.
 

Phil E


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On a tenuously related point, did anyone else see the ref in one of the 6 nations games this weekend penalise the opposition for all chanting 5, 4, 3, 2 after the announced use it?

I think he said something like they are refereeing the game.
 

didds

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On a tenuously related point, did anyone else see the ref in one of the 6 nations games this weekend penalise the opposition for all chanting 5, 4, 3, 2 after the announced use it?

I think he said something like they are refereeing the game.
I didn't - but was that the side WITH the ball, or the oppo waiting for the ball to be played?

TBH if its the defenders, I think thats quite funny :)
 

crossref


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But that's not the referees fault. 5 seconds is 5 seconds long.
which is exactly what I said !
Doesn't matter what the referees do the ball will always be slow as Law has no urgency in it
 

Stu10


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On a tenuously related point, did anyone else see the ref in one of the 6 nations games this weekend penalise the opposition for all chanting 5, 4, 3, 2 after the announced use it?

I think he said something like they are refereeing the game.

I didn't spot that, but I noted the very first England ruck in the game v France the referee said very early, when the ball first emerged, "available, use it" then he leaned into the scrum half and said "five" (I don't think he counted down to one, but not sure)... just as the ball arrived at the back foot of the rear most player in the caterpillar the ref shouted "ball out".

I immediately thought that it could get interesting today, but he didn't do it again. I did also note throughout the game that France do not often setup a caterpillar.
 

Phil E


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I didn't - but was that the side WITH the ball, or the oppo waiting for the ball to be played?

TBH if its the defenders, I think thats quite funny :)

Not sure it was the England game?

One team had the ball at the base and the ref called "use it".
The opposition then began counting and the ref penalised them, pointing out at least two players.
 

didds

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I noticed that too Stu.
i did think later though he abandoned that approach completely
 
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