[Scrum] When is the ball "out" of the scrum?

[nightrider56]

The scrum ends when the ball comes out of the scrum in any direction except the tunnel, but what does "out" actually mean?
My specific circumstances are:The ball is fed into the scrum and successfully hooked back. It ends up at the feet of the blind side flanker, who unbinds, picks up the ball and advances towards the opposition goal line.
In these circumstances is the ball "out" of the scrum and has the scrum ended just as if the No.8 had unbound and done the same thing, or is the BSF offside / playing he ball wit his hands in the scrum??
The good book is not clear.
I allowed play on as I considered the ball to be out........was I right??
Cheers

 

[crossref]

we had a bit of discussion about this a few weeks ago

Only the 'hindmost' player can unbind before the ball is out, and pick the ball up.
That's normally the #8 obviusly.

If the scrum had wheeled it's conceivable that the flanker could be the hindmost player, and then it's OK

(at U19 and below where it's illegal to deliberately wheel the scrum, you probably don't want to be allowing flankers to become the hindmost player and pick up)

 

[nightrider56]

Thanks for the reply. The book only refers to No. 8 so I see that and your point on wheeling.
However, it still doesn't answer when he ball is actually "out" For example (assuming no other foul / illegal play) if the ball ends up under the chest of the flanker is that still considered to be "in" the scrum?

 

[didds]

the egenarl rule of interpretation is the "elastic band" theory.

ie imagine a huge elatic band stretched around the outside of the scrum. Is the ball inside the elastic band? Then its inside the scrum.

And ignore any tripe about birds pooing it, cos there are clear times when the ball is within the elstic band but a bird poo could land on it (eg splayed #8s legs)

didds

 

[didds]

if the ball ends up under the chest of the flanker is that still considered to be "in" the scrum?

Yep, still in - but I'd say its more to do with feet position (back to that elsatic band). The interesting thing here is that should the flanker move his olutside foot inside the ball, the ball is now outside the scrum, has therefore left iot and the scrum is now over. Flanker can now unbind and pick the ball up

caveat: will probably end up wearing the oppo flanker if he does! LOL

didds

 

[nightrider56]

Cheers guys, great answers