[Tackle] WR: Decision-making framework for high tackles

Rich_NL

Rich_NL

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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_dMSSNNeoHs

A dispatch from the powers that be - distinguishing (and defining) the difference between shoulder charge and high tackle, and the consequences/expected sanctions associated.

Shoulder charge:
No head contact - YC if dangerous, penalty if not
Head contact - RC

Can be mitigated by C&O factors, like the BC dropping or the offender losing line of sight

High Tackle:
Tackler directly contacts BC head with shoulder/head - RC if dangerous, YC if not
Tackler directly contacts BC head with arm/elbow - RC if dangerous, YC if not
Tackler indirectly contacts head - YC if dangerous, penalty if not

No head contact (e.g. seatbelt tackle) - penalty

Again, can be aggravated or mitigated by C&O factors, like the cynical play, BC dropping into contact, or the offender losing line of sight.

Notes:
The controversial Owen Farrell charge/tackle from SA is used as the example of a dangerous shoulder charge, deserving a yellow card
About 5:25, a non-completed high tackle is described as dangerous because the tackle is completed
I'm not sure why they differentiate which body part the tackler makes contact with for high tackle, it makes no difference
I really don't think this will clarify things for most people...
 
Phil E

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So here is the video...

And here is the flowchart...
HT flowchart.jpg
 
Phil E

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Tackle made, ball passed away, you have a split second to work your way through that flowchart before the next tackle :chin:
 
Flish

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In terms of outcomes and guidance has anything actually changed? Or is it just formalising in one place the guidance we've had and seen for the last year or so, eg direct contact with head, with force, off you go
 
Phil E

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Flish said:
In terms of outcomes and guidance has anything actually changed? Or is it just formalising in one place the guidance we've had and seen for the last year or so, eg direct contact with head, with force, off you go
Click to expand...

Watching the video, if it is followed religiously, I can see a LOT more cards.

Penalty only for:
seatbelt tackle (no contact with the head or neck),
and low tackle that rides up (no contact with the head or neck).

All other high tackles start with a card.
 
thepercy

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Flish said:
In terms of outcomes and guidance has anything actually changed? Or is it just formalising in one place the guidance we've had and seen for the last year or so, eg direct contact with head, with force, off you go
Click to expand...

I was thinking the same thing. Nothing has changed, just a fancy new chart.
 
Flish

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Phil E said:
Watching the video, if it is followed religiously, I can see a LOT more cards.

Penalty only for:
seatbelt tackle (no contact with the head or neck),
and low tackle that rides up (no contact with the head or neck).

All other high tackles start with a card.
Click to expand...

*If* being the key. I don’t see much changing for me in grass roots land with one view from whatever angle I end up at, I have to be sure with any sanction, so suspect I’ll still ’know It’ if it’s red. In TMO land I could imagine the dialogue changing to walk through this, and yes, maybe more cards.
 
Rich_NL

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A dangerous/reckless ride-up high tackle is now YC, where it would have been red (according to the Jan '17 directive, rather than practice). At the time of the Farrell tackle, Angus Gardner said most refs he'd spoken with thought it was a penalty and not a YC. I don't think the example from the women's game would be consistently reffed.

Other than that, it's mostly formalizing common sense and explaining mitigating/aggravating factors concretely, so it should help with top-level consistency and give grassroots refs a method to think about and defend decisions.
 
Ciaran Trainor

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Well that seems to be a well thought out presentation. I guess dominant tacklers will not like it! Still not sure where your arm should be for a proper tackle, in front or behind your shoulder?
 
C

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Flish said:
In terms of outcomes and guidance has anything actually changed? Or is it just formalising in one place the guidance we've had and seen for the last year or so, eg direct contact with head, with force, off you go
Click to expand...

If you rephrase a Law (or bit of guidance) using different words then it's a changed Law
 
Phil E

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ctrainor said:
Well that seems to be a well thought out presentation. I guess dominant tacklers will not like it! Still not sure where your arm should be for a proper tackle, in front or behind your shoulder?
Click to expand...

If its behind (or in a sling position) then its a shoulder charge, not a tackle. The video explains it all better than the flow chart.
 
Dickie E

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Phil E said:
Did you watch the guidance video?
There's a Farrell tackle in there as one of the examples.....and its illegal.
Click to expand...

what about the other 2?
 
Phil E

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Dickie E said:
watch out for the splinters :)
Click to expand...

You're going to have to learn as a referee to make your own decisions and not rely on others :wink:
 
A

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1. Def no attempt to wrap. Leading arm in the "Sling" position more or less. Plenty time to site the BC and line him up properly. YC maybe even RC.

2. Farrell's no even tackling the player with the ball!!!! There was a high tackle from the other player though, I'd probably YC both

3. As the first tackle. No wrap, I don't think its as back as the other one though, in terms of outcome. But I don't ref based on outcome. YC
 
Rich_NL

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Dickie E said:
what about the other 2?
Click to expand...

Number 2 - White 10 shoulder charge, no head contact, not a dominant tackle, penalty only. White 23 high tackle to head, off feet, RC.

Number 3 - Can't tell much from the video on this screen. No wrap, can't see C&O head contact, YC or penalty.
 
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