can you beat this?

[TheBFG]

Saturday, L7 game........................ Uncontested scrums after 2mins and 30 seconds :wow:


Now the cynical side of me says they came with a plan, but that really backfired when I informed them they would play the next 67 mins with 14 players! For some reason they seemed not to know this? They were a Glos team (OB, maybe you can throw some light on that?)

Oh at this point a flanker said he could play prop, I said OK, but if it proved he wasn't up to it, I would force them to take a player off, continue uncontested with 14 on the field, he stuffed his opposite number :wink:

 

[OB..]

In Gloucester leagues (L8 down) we do not play the man-off rule. If they were recently promoted they might not have realised the change.

 

[Rushforth]

77..?

 

[TheBFG]

In Gloucester leagues (L8 down) we do not play the man-off rule. If they were recently promoted they might not have realised the change.

Nope other way round, they're on their way down (Cheltenham)

 

[Simon Thomas]

No FR replacement in the 3 subs ? Was the Cheltenham flanker the nominated FR replacement on the match card ? If not, should by the letter of regs have gone to uncontested and match forfeit as no supplied nominated and STE FR.

As K's won anyway immaterial I suppose, as they want the 30 points scored not a HWO 0-0 and also -5 League points would not take C down to relegation zone.

 

[Dixie]

Saturday, L7 game........................ Uncontested scrums after 2mins and 30 seconds :wow:


Now the cynical side of me says they came with a plan, but that really backfired when I informed them they would play the next 67 mins with 14 players!

Just done the maths.

L.7 in Zummerzet only get to play 70 minutes? Is that because the ref had a drop of Scrump to keep the cold out, or are the players the unfit ones? :wink:

 

[Accylad]

Cheltenham have got prop problems this season but having come from L6 they should know the score. Will chat to coach when I next see him....

 

[Lee Lifeson-Peart]

Cheltenham have got prop problems this season but having come from L6 they should know the score. Will chat to coach when I next see him....

'Ere - where be aaal thoi praaaaps?

 

[Browner]

No FR replacement in the 3 subs ? Was the Cheltenham flanker the nominated FR replacement on the match card ? If not, should by the letter of regs have gone to uncontested and match forfeit as no supplied nominated and STE FR.

As K's won anyway immaterial I suppose, as they want the 30 points scored not a HWO 0-0 and also -5 League points would not take C down to relegation zone.

Simon, immaterial to the league position maybe , but putting aside BFGs match for a moment.

Conseptually if a player isn't initially declared as one of the STE prior to the match and then is asked to play ( presumably he could claim feeling pressured by teammates or by the referee insistence of '14 from now on' ) AND he then gets seriously injured ...???

Would a referee be liable, culpable, , other ??

Its been suggested to me by an assessor that it mustn't be allowed, or maybe that assessor was just scaremongering ?

 

[Lee Lifeson-Peart]

In league games I always check to see that there are 4 x FRs on the cards.

I also take a photo of the cards as handed in - I sometimes have to hand them back and get the "FR" marked.

In Merit Leagues/Friendly games where there are no cards then I would accept that anyone fronting up to play FR is STE.

I am not sure if the Yorkshire Merit Leagues have man-off - I'd better look next time I have one. It has never been an issue up to now.

I think we have all had a really weedy game where someone has said "I'll have a go". In those cases I will accept STE but watch how the volunteer performs and/or talk to his opposite number. Forwards and FRs especially hate u/c scrums and will try a accommodate a contest if they can IME.

 

[Accylad]

'Ere - where be aaal thoi praaaaps?

As I am from Accrington and lived in Harrogate for nearly 10 years before coming down here it is unlikely to sound quite like that..... :shrug:

 

[Lee Lifeson-Peart]

As I am from Accrington and lived in Harrogate for nearly 10 years before coming down here it is unlikely to sound quite like that..... :shrug:

My regional stereotyping will be no fun if I have to do research.

I lived in Harrogate too for a bit - I met my wife there - it has a lot to answer for! :biggrin:

 

[Accylad]

My regional stereotyping will be no fun if I have to do research.

By gum you're right! epper:

 

[crossref]

Simon, immaterial to the league position maybe , but putting aside BFGs match for a moment.

Conseptually if a player isn't initially declared as one of the STE prior to the match and then is asked to play ( presumably he could claim feeling pressured by teammates or by the referee insistence of '14 from now on' ) AND he then gets seriously injured ...???

Would a referee be liable, culpable, , other ??

Its been suggested to me by an assessor that it mustn't be allowed, or maybe that assessor was just scaremongering ?

for any front row player it's not up to the referee to research the extent of a players T and E, and to determine if that's suitable. The team say a player is STE, the ref accepts that.

if a team is 'hiding' an STE player (ie not declared on the team sheet), with the intention of revealing his presence later, only if it suits them, then this feels to me more like a matter to be reported to league organisers, rather than a safety/ref issue.

 

[Lee Lifeson-Peart]

By gum you're right! epper:

Loook! D'yer not like regional stereotyping? D'yer not? :biggrin:

 

[TheBFG]

LH was (IMHO) carrying an injury before the game started, he lasted 20 secs max! Sub on for him, then he goes down injured too! all inside 3 mins. So they met their obligation of having a sub (so don't get docked points), but when he went off they thought they were going to play uncontested with 15 on the pitch :nono:

 

[Simon Thomas]

In league games I always check to see that there are 4 x FRs on the cards.

I also take a photo of the cards as handed in - I sometimes have to hand them back and get the "FR" marked.

In Merit Leagues/Friendly games where there are no cards then I would accept that anyone fronting up to play FR is STE.

LLP - Good practice. But at Merit I would ask skipper to please confirm that he is STE FR.

 

[Lee Lifeson-Peart]

LLP - Good practice. But at Merit I would ask skipper to please confirm that he is STE FR.

Any discussions about FRs are carried out with the skipper and the volunteer/victim IME.

I don't think anyone has volunteered without the knowledge of their skipper and I would confirm with the skipper if they did.

 

[Simon Thomas]

Simon, immaterial to the league position maybe , but putting aside BFGs match for a moment.

Conseptually if a player isn't initially declared as one of the STE prior to the match and then is asked to play ( presumably he could claim feeling pressured by teammates or by the referee insistence of '14 from now on' ) AND he then gets seriously injured ...???

Would a referee be liable, culpable, , other ??

Its been suggested to me by an assessor that it mustn't be allowed, or maybe that assessor was just scaremongering ?

I agree with the assessor's advice to you.

That is why a referee's briefing pre-match asks who are the FR and are they STE. And who are the nominated STE replacement(s).

In an RFU League match we have a card where 4 (L5 and below) and 5 (National Leagues) are the STE and marked FR.

My advice to any referee is that if a player was not nominated as FR STE pre-match then forget it and go un opposed. After Vowles, Wilbraham et al the modern judicial and compensatory society we live in could take the referee for liability (not would but could) and insurance companies are increasingly litigious and quick to decline claims, liability, and try to pin it someone else.

 

[Ciaran Trainor]

I think it's fair anough if a team wants to hide the fact the have extra STE they are playing by the rules, if they suddenly appear and are STE not my problem.
Some of my games I struggle to see anyone who can't play in the Front Row!!