Joe marler and White Boots

[crossref]

Maybe not for you as an older adult, but today's kids/young adults don't know the history of nigger, yet they hear it it every 2nd song sung by African Americans (will.i.am to name one..) so they think it's a common and acceptable word and are now prone to using it not understanding the racial undertones. Of course it makes us cringe and jump down our kids throats about using racial terms.

I'd say that if today's generation start using the word in everyday language, it's not racist, and if black people are now offended by it then I think they've only got their hip hop popstars and themselves to blame.

do you actually know any young people?

 

[Browner]

Maybe not for you as an older adult, but today's kids/young adults don't know the history of nigger, yet they hear it it every 2nd song sung by African Americans (will.i.am to name one..) so they think it's a common and acceptable word and are now prone to using it not understanding the racial undertones. Of course it makes us cringe and jump down our kids throats about using racial terms.

I'd say that if today's generation start using the word in everyday language, it's not racist, and if black people are now offended by it then I think they've only got their hip hop popstars and themselves to blame.

Spot on.

On a tangent, if you asked anyone under 25 to tell you what they know about Sambo , they'd likely start thinking about an Ajax midfielder? or perhaps he's Chelsea's new summer signing? , or searching their PS4 to see how much he costs to purchase!

Treat everyone the same, absolutely, don't discriminate , include everyone in your jokes and give everyone the same/similar response when they offend you.... irrespective of anything ....AND demand that it works both ways , always.

A 'bald twit' has exactly the same abuse value as a fat/ugly/ginger/short/black/gypsy/Welsh/hairy/lanky or Cornish twit statement.

 

[leaguerefaus]

Spot on.

On a tangent, if you asked anyone under 25 to tell you what they know about Sambo , they'd likely start thinking about an Ajax midfielder? or perhaps he's Chelsea's new summer signing? , or searching their PS4 to see how much he costs to purchase!

Treat everyone the same, absolutely, don't discriminate , include everyone in your jokes and give everyone the same/similar response when they offend you.... irrespective of anything ....AND demand that it works both ways , always.

A 'bald twit' has exactly the same abuse value as a fat/ugly/ginger/short/black/gypsy/Welsh/hairy/lanky or Cornish twit statement.

I had to google 'sambo'. I'm 21. Point proven.

Edit: I'm actually 20. Maybe this proves I'm just a bloody moron.

 

[4eyesbetter]

I've got a different idea. Next time you see an 18-25 black bloke on the street, walk over, ask him if he knows how to get to some place of local interest, and then finish this pleasant little chat with "all right, thanks Sambo", and you can see whether or not he chins you. You might find that people who actually are the targets of this shite know full well what it means.

 

[Dickie E]

Maybe not for you as an older adult, but today's kids/young adults don't know the history of nigger, yet they hear it it every 2nd song sung by African Americans

How else was Kanye going to rhyme with Gold digger?

My wife despises the C word except when she uses it to describe her ex sister-in-law. Go figure :holysheep:

 

[Ian_Cook]

No, as a white person you cannot use a word to a black person that has historically been used by white people to dehumanise black people and justify everything from coppers giving them a kicking to denying them housing in smart parts of town to literal slavery. Do you see how a black person might have a problem with that?

However, when black people use that word among themselves it may not carry those connotations, and some feel free to do what they like with it. This is not difficult.

Actually, that is how it ended up, but it isn't how the word started, i.e. the word "nigger" was not just dreamed up by some racist as a pejorative.

The word started as a "southern drawl" mispronunciation of the word "negro". In the Southern States, particularly, Georgia, Alabama, South Carolina and Louisiana, it was (and I believe, still is) common in the dialect to truncate and mispronounce common words ending in "o" with a "eh" or an "er" sound, and transpose an "i" sound for an "e" or "o" sound (and vice versa) in the middle of the word, e.g.

Mosquito > miskeeter
Potato > pitayter
Albino > albeener

This happened to "negro", it became "negra" then "nigra" (nih-grah) then finally misspelled to how it was pronounced.

"he's jus' one-a them thar nigras"

 

[menace]

do you actually know any young people?

Thanks for being patronising.

If being the father of a 16 yo, 14yo and 10 yo, and coach, team manager of a rugby team from u10 to u 16...an a junior appointments coordinator...then yes I guess I do know a few young people. (Stupid bloody white-honky pommy whinging twat :biggrin: I'd use the C word, but dickie e missus doesn't like it and I wouldn't want to offend her!)

So I speak from experience when I've had to chat to a few young people about using the word nigga, including my kids who had to be educated when they heard it and used it without knowing the full implications of what it meant. The new one is 'coon' - I'll let you google it, but they're using it as a new word to mean something completely different to what I knew it as! So they're now getting a lesson not to use it in any conversation. (Bit like how 'gay' changed')

 

[Ian_Cook]

Thanks for being patronising.

If being the father of a 16 yo, 14yo and 10 yo, and coach, team manager of a rugby team from u10 to u 16...an a junior appointments coordinator...then yes I guess I do know a few young people. (Stupid bloody white-honky pommy whinging twat :biggrin: I'd use the C word, but dickie e missus doesn't like it and I wouldn't want to offend her!)

So I speak from experience when I've had to chat to a few young people about using the word nigga, including my kids who had to be educated when they heard it and used it without knowing the full implications of what it meant. The new one is 'coon' - I'll let you google it, but they're using it as a new word to mean something completely different to what I knew it as! So they're now getting a lesson not to use it in any conversation. (Bit like how 'gay' changed')

"Coon" is a really interesting one, and it is not new or even recent. It is a very old slur dating back nearly 200 years to the minstrel shows of the early 19th century. It is thought to refer to a song called "Zip Coon" a popular song at that time, sung to the same melody as the square-dancing song "Turkey in the Straw".

 

[crossref]

Wow.
Tbh I think it might be better if this thread was deleted

 

[Ian_Cook]

Wow.
Tbh I think it might be better if this thread was deleted

...Why?

 

[crossref]

Because this is no longer a refereeing related thread , so adds nothing to the purpose of the site.. to make better referees, while meanwhile the attitudes expressed reflect badly on us as community.

 

[crossref]

do you actually know any young people?

Thanks for being patronising.

If being the father of a 16 yo, 14yo and 10 yo, and coach, team manager of a rugby team from u10 to u 16...an a junior appointments coordinator...then yes I guess I do know a few young people. (Stupid bloody white-honky pommy whinging twat :biggrin: I'd use the C word, but dickie e missus doesn't like it and I wouldn't want to offend her!)

So I speak from experience when I've had to chat to a few young people about using the word nigga, including my kids who had to be educated when they heard it and used it without knowing the full implications of what it meant. The new one is 'coon' - I'll let you google it, but they're using it as a new word to mean something completely different to what I knew it as! So they're now getting a lesson not to use it in any conversation. (Bit like how 'gay' changed')

Well I don't hear any young people using the N word and claiming or expecting it to be inoffensive.
The only place I seem to encounter that is here on this forum. By middle aged people.

 

[Ian_Cook]

Could someone please explain why this thread has been closed

There is nothing wrong with discussing pejoratives. I'm of the opinion that discussion of how pejoratives originate and why they become unacceptable is a great education tool to help people understand why they should not be used.

Saying that "you mustn't use this word or that word" is OK, but it is ALWAYS better to explain why

 

[OB..]

Could someone please explain why this thread has been closed

There is nothing wrong with discussing pejoratives. I'm of the opinion that discussion of how pejoratives originate and why they become unacceptable is a great education tool to help people understand why they should not be used.

Saying that "you mustn't use this word or that word" is OK, but it is ALWAYS better to explain why

It's a sensitive subject, and part of the problem is that people shy away from discussion for fear of emotive outbursts.

In the long run it is better to face the problem as objectively as you can. Ignoring it won't make it go away.

 

[Ian_Cook]

It's a sensitive subject, and part of the problem is that people shy away from discussion for fear of emotive outbursts.

In the long run it is better to face the problem as objectively as you can. Ignoring it won't make it go away.

Precisely my point!