London Welsh to be charged for fielding an ineligble player.

Simon Thomas


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total cock up (and taking short cuts with incomplete documentation) by former Manager Mike Scott when he signed Tyson last summer in rush to get a sqaud together once LW had won promotion case v RFU. It has been brought to RFU attention by London Welsh after an internal investigation, but I can guess what is going to happen - 12 points minimum and assured relegation.
 

didds

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which will be a positive go-forward outcome.


winner.

as in michael.

didds
 

Taff


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total cock up (and taking short cuts with incomplete documentation) .... It has been brought to RFU attention by London Welsh after an internal investigation, but I can guess what is going to happen - 12 points minimum and assured relegation.
I don't know if you're being serious Mr T, but hasn't a precedent been set? From the BBC article it says

In 2007, Leicester Tigers were docked one point for fielding a player who had been temporarily registered with another club. Sale Sharks were also docked one league point and fined £5,000 for fielding an unregistered player in their Premiership match against Harlequins in 2009. The last Premiership club to be docked points were Exeter, who received a two-point deduction and £5,000 fine in April 2011 for fielding too many overseas players in a league game against Leeds Carnegie.

In mitigation, London Welsh came clean themselves (ie it was more of a cock-up than a conspiracy) which must surely count in their favour, not make matters worse.

How many get relegated each season? I guess it's one, but I don't know. :chin:
 
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crossref


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is that the same Mike Scott who worked with Mark Evans at Quins for a long time
 

ianh5979


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The reports i have heard says he played 13 times as unregistered player so at 1 point per game 12 points looks about right
 

Simon Thomas


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taff - yes I am being serious (as a long term LW supporter [even when playing elsewhere just down the A316] and ex-LW Colts player).

Standard 'tariff' under RFU League Regs are two deducted points for each match the un-registered player was in - that was as you say the precedent set in the Exeter case. So that will be 9 Premiership matches = -18 points ! He has played in other comps like Amlin as well, and maybe they will want their "pound of flesh" too ?

Mitigation - LW found the error and put their hand up. It appears to be an error not deliberate (the review will find out). Person responsible is long gone.

Hence I predict it will be one docked point per the 9 matches plus a three point discipline deduction too = 12

This is not London 2 League rugby but fully professional Premiership showbiz £££££ rugby, with multi-million pound turnover clubs and full time paid admin staff. The other clubs (especially Sale and London Irish) will no doubt expect a full application of the regulations.
 
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Simon Thomas


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The reports i have heard says he played 13 times as unregistered player so at 1 point per game 12 points looks about right

in which case the reports you are reading are wrong !

He has played 13 times and I am told that for 9 of those he was incorrectly registered as a UK citizen/domicile. Once the mistake was identified he was correctly registered as an overseas player, with the additional documentation required, and so for the latest four Premiership matches he has been fully 'legal'. That is echoed by syndicated Press Association reports I have seen.

As a second observation, don't expect any RFU mercy. Even in the grassroots competitions the RFU Comps folks can be very dogmatic.

My home club played a national RFU Vase cup match and due to last minute injuries etc played a "home from University" player, selected that morning when the injuries were confirmed. He had been at the club since a six year old, all the way to Colts (U18) level, and had been a Hampshire County U18 player.

He played and was duly entered on the match card - two weeks later RFU Comps said he was not registered on RugbyFirst for Cup matches and so the won match was now lost as we had played an unregistered player.

We appealed, showed he was registered as player as a youth for most of his life, but we lost the appeal. You have to re-register any youth members as adults (we now do it automatically at 17 years old) and make sure they are registered for both RFU league and RFU cup comps. It just so happens he is now doing his masters at a University who have a RFU League position (in Hampshire 2 !) and is registered both with them and our home club - which is allowed it seems - crazy. So one week he can play at L9 and the next at L10 or play for the club in League and then Uni in the national cup. He could play in county cup for uni without any registration.
 
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Taff


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Taff - yes I am being serious (as a long term LW supporter [even when playing elsewhere just down the A316] and ex-LW Colts player). Standard 'tariff' under RFU League Regs are two deducted points for each match the un-registered player was in - that was as you say the precedent set in the Exeter case. So that will be 9 Premiership matches = -18 points ! He has played in other comps like Amlin as well, and maybe they will want their "pound of flesh" too?
Well, that's them relegated then. :frown:

I didn't realise it was so proportionate to the number of games played. You learn something every day.
 

winchesterref


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I hope they get some leniency. As far as I understand it, he would have been eligible anyway if he had been registered correctly? I.e. ticked the right box!

Plus Sale have acted like a laughing stock of a club this year and it would do Steve Diamond some good to spend time in the Championship thinking about his actions.
 

Simon Thomas


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Well, that's them relegated then. :frown:

I didn't realise it was so proportionate to the number of games played. You learn something every day.

NO - only my point of view. Past experiences show the RFU very rarely agree with me, so LW are still in with a chance !

Maybe they will just get a 2 or 3 point sanction ?
 

crossref


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NO - only my point of view. Past experiences show the RFU very rarely agree with me, so LW are still in with a chance !

Maybe they will just get a 2 or 3 point sanction ?

even a two or three point sanction might mean curtains for them :(
 

Simon Thomas


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even a two or three point sanction might mean curtains for them :(

agreed crossref I can only see one more win, and even Nigel D sees just two apparently.

Sale look on an upward curve and London Irish are digging in deep.
 

Browner

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Given that some clubs didn't want LW in the Top flight ... maybe he's a double agent !:buttkick:
 
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