Refs for HEC Finals?

[chief]

Whose reffing them? Any ideas? Found a very strong interest in this years HEC, going for Toulouse!

 

[stuart3826]

I usually get sent the ERU appointments as soon as they're announced. I'll keep you posted

 

[Donal1988]

Hasnt been announced to my knowledge. Its a decent bet that either Wayne Barnes or Nigel Owens will be doing it as there are 2 Irish teams in the Semis and 2 French teams. Rolland would be a good option if its an All French affair.

 

[chief]

Well I just read who they are. Nigel Owens and Dave Pearson. I've watched a lot of games this year and have seen them both referee, and can I just say, wow. What a joke.

 

[FlipFlop]

Well, look at it this way:

As the games are Irish v French, you rule out all the Irish and French refs.

The Scots aren't good enough, so that leave Welsh and English refs.

Take the top 3, and appoint to final, and 2 semi's.

So that means Barnes doing the final, meaning NO gets a semi. Now the 3rd place one. There are better than DP, but he is just rising up, and has generally handled himself well, and is probably seen as needing a game on a bigger stage.

Not saying they would be my choices, but can see the logic.

 

[Robert Burns]

Well I just read who they are. Nigel Owens and Dave Pearson. I've watched a lot of games this year and have seen them both referee, and can I just say, wow. What a joke.

That's the Semi's, not the finals.

Barnsey & Poite doing the Challenge Cup Semi's.

 

[Ian_Cook]

Well I just read who they are. Nigel Owens and Dave Pearson. I've watched a lot of games this year and have seen them both referee, and can I just say, wow. What a joke.

What is your beef with Dave Pearson?

 

[chief]

What is your beef with Dave Pearson?

Ian I have beef with everyone.

I like Pearson actually. Been impressed with a few of his games, his Scotland v Italy match was pretty dodgey though.... Also a few of his games in the HEC have been pretty average, would have rathered Barnes, do both a semi and a final. But come on, is he really up to HEC Semi Finals?

 

[Ian_Cook]

Ian I have beef with everyone.

I like Pearson actually. Been impressed with a few of his games, his Scotland v Italy match was pretty dodgey though.... Also a few of his games in the HEC have been pretty average, would have rathered Barnes, do both a semi and a final. But come on, is he really up to HEC Semi Finals?

Dave Pearson is no noob.
2002 Premiership debut (Harlequins v Exiles)
2005 Powergen Cup Final (Leeds v Bath) and Premiership SF (Wasps v Sale)
2006 Premiership Final (Sale v Leicester) and Heineken Cup QF (Tououse v Leinster)
2008 Premiership SF (Gloucester v Leicester)
2009 Premiership SF (Leicester v Bath)
2010 Heineken Cup QF (Leinster v Clermont-Auvergne)

I think he is well experienced enough to handle an ERC Semi

That's the Semi's, not the finals.

Barnsey & Poite doing the Challenge Cup Semi's.

Note for Robert and others. In these parts the term "Finals" (plural) is a colloquial term that applies to all post season matches;

Semi-Finals,
Quarter Finals
Qualifying Finals
Elimination Finals
Grand Finals

You will often hear the term "Finals Football" applied to these matches.

 

[chief]

Dave Pearson is no noob.
2002 Premiership debut (Harlequins v Exiles)
2005 Powergen Cup Final (Leeds v Bath) and Premiership SF (Wasps v Sale)
2006 Premiership Final (Sale v Leicester) and Heineken Cup QF (Tououse v Leinster)
2008 Premiership SF (Gloucester v Leicester)
2009 Premiership SF (Leicester v Bath)
2010 Heineken Cup QF (Leinster v Clermont-Auvergne)

I think he is well experienced enough to handle an ERC Semi



Note for Robert and others. In these parts the term "Finals" (plural) is a colloquial term that applies to all post season matches;

Semi-Finals,
Quarter Finals
Qualifying Finals
Elimination Finals
Grand Finals

You will often hear the term "Finals Football" applied to these matches.

Pearson's a good ref,just thought maybe Wayne Barnes would be in control of one of them. As he is one of the IRB's top refs at the moment. But it must be that he'll get the final.

Also experience can be one thing, but with Bryce Lawrence's resume, or even Stu Dickinson's would you want either of them in charge of say a Super 14 Final?

 

[OB..]

Note for Robert and others. In these parts the term "Finals" (plural) is a colloquial term that applies to all post season matches;

Semi-Finals,
Quarter Finals
Qualifying Finals
Elimination Finals
Grand Finals

I think everybody understands references to "World Cup Finals". In this case there are two matches each of which is actually THE final of the particular competition, so the plural is "finals" ie plenty of scope for misunderstanding and confusion built in to the context..

 

[Robert Burns]

Ian,

I always get confused when it comes to finals series out here, the teams play one wins one loses, but yet I see the losers in the final that I referee..

I've learnt to not care and just referee the teams.

What is wrong with just getting your eight teams and going:

QTR Final
Semi Final
Final

Is it a money making exersize perhaps?

 

[Ian_Cook]

Ian,

I always get confused when it comes to finals series out here, the teams play one wins one loses, but yet I see the losers in the final that I referee..

I've learnt to not care and just referee the teams.

What is wrong with just getting your eight teams and going:

QTR Final
Semi Final
Final

Is it a money making exersize perhaps?

Its called the McIntyre system. There are several of them involving different numbers of teams, but they all work on similar principles. They are designed to reward teams better for their higher finishing positions.

I will explain the simplest one (the original Four Team system) and comparit with the staright knockout system

In the GP, S14, T14, NPC, the straight knockout system is used. Semi-finalists are the Top Four, but no matter what their finishing position, they have one life. Lose and they are out. Top of the table's only reward is to play the supposedly weaker of the top four. (I think Tigers supporters would argue that 4th is not always weaker)

SF1 = 1 v 4
SF2 = 2 v 3.
The winners go straight to the Grand Final

In the Four Team McIntrye system, the Top two teams have an extra life, and the next two teams have to win two matches to get into the final.

SF1 = 3v4
- winner goes to the Preliminary Final
- loser is out

SF2 = 1v2
- winner goes straight to the Grand Final
- loser goes to the Preliminary Final

Preliminary Final SF1 loser v SF2 winner
- winner goes to the Grand Final
- loser is out


There are other systems involving more teams. This Wikipedia page explain it quite well.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/McIntyre_System

 

[Bryan]

Similar to the "Double Knockout System" but based on your seedings in the table. I'm a big fan and wished it was used for the GP / S14 finals.

 

[Robert Burns]

Anything that keeps me on the rugby field is ok by me.

Understand a bit better now too, thanks Ian.

 

[Simon Thomas]

I usually get sent the ERU appointments as soon as they're announced. I'll keep you posted

Please can we call the second level European competition by its proper name the Amlin Cup, as our client has spent £££ sponsoring it :biggrin:

 

[stuart3826]

Please can we call the second level European competition by its proper name the Amlin Cup, as our client has spent £££ sponsoring it :biggrin:

ERU=Elite Referee Unit:noyc:

 

[Donal1988]

Have to say I thought Pearson actually had a good game. Even though we leaked in 18 points from penalty kicks I have no problems with his performance. His assistants kept in contact with him throughout the game and there was just a very solid performance from him. Dunno did anyone else see the game.

 

[Ian_Cook]

A question if I may?

Where the hell is the sense in having two French teams play in a final at Murrayfield of all places, instead of Stade de France?

Murrayfield has 15,000 lower capacity and is a lot further away.

Imagine if the Super 14 final was Bulls v Stormers, and it was held in Sydney? There would be an outcry in South Africa.

 

[chopper15]

Just a quickie, please.

There being three groups in the England Championship playoffs, can someone explain how the semis are to be arranged to decide who replaces Worcester?