Waybe Barnes Yellow Card Sexton 10

[CrouchTPEngage]

Just on one point about Wales milking a penalty. They are within diving distance of the line. A probable quick ball and a try is a distinct possibility. Most players are looking for quick ball and dive over the line before Irish defenders get organised. I can't believe Wales were thinking "I'll get 3 points here if I just make sure Sexton gets stuck."

 

[ChrisR]

I don't think anyone is saying Wales was milking a PK.

Another point: WB clearly says "> . . killing the ball on the line" Did the proximity to goal influence his decision and should it have? is this an 'outcome' influenced decision?

 

[DocY]

I don't think anyone is saying Wales was milking a PK.

Another point: WB clearly says "> . . killing the ball on the line" Did the proximity to goal influence his decision and should it have? is this an 'outcome' influenced decision?

I think you're unlikely to see a player deliberately killing the ball on the opposition 22 carded.

 

[ChrisR]

Then why would it be a card here if it isn't a card on the 22?

 

[The Fat]

Then why would it be a card here if it isn't a card on the 22?

I sympathise with your thinking here but the fact is that a cynical offence in the "red zone" is always going to be more likely to get a YC as it is usually snuffing out a try scoring opportunity.

 

[Pegleg]

Cannot help wondering if the match referee questioned the condition of the playing surface when he discovered the Welsh have over watered the pitch to create wet conditions even though the roof was closed. Clear gamesmanship by the home side.

Oh dear. :holysheep:

 

[ChuckieB]

Cannot help wondering if the match referee questioned the condition of the playing surface when he discovered the Welsh have over watered the pitch to create wet conditions even though the roof was closed. Clear gamesmanship by the home side.

Aah the roof debate again! The Welsh and their Roof!

........what's the minimum no. of posts it takes to get off topic?:chin:

 

[L'irlandais]

Discussions have been known to go off topic by the first reply.

I agree with The Fat, in the Red Zone the card was more likely. However Green10's tackle was a skillful try saving tackle. The card is harsh, because it is untrue that he failed to roll away. He was prevented from rolling away. For me, it shows a complete lack of empathy from WB. Wales targeted Sexton all evening.

Such is the nature of Elite rugby, no more respect. If the opposition have a key player, either you injury him or get him carded, well done Pros, nothing could be further from the roots of the game. Pretty dumb to undermine their own chosen profession, but then that's their own lookout.

 

[Treadmore]

Discussions have been known to go off topic by the first reply.

I agree with The Fat, in the Red Zone the card was more likely. However Green10's tackle was a skillful try saving tackle. The card is harsh, because it is untrue that he failed to roll away. He was prevented from rolling away. For me, it shows a complete lack of empathy from WB. Wales targeted Sexton all evening.

Such is the nature of Elite rugby, no more respect. If the opposition have a key player, either you injury him or get him carded, well done Pros, nothing could be further from the roots of the game. Pretty dumb to undermine their own chosen profession, but then that's their own lookout.

Or Barnes showed empathy for the team denied quick ball?

Who'd a thunk a fly-half might be "targeted" during a game? Never see that in the "roots of the game"

 

[DocY]

Aye, and wasn't it skilful of the Welsh BC to wrap Sextons legs around himself and get him to fall on the wrong side. Then to completely immobilise him so he wasn't capable of even the slightest movement.

Very skilful and also prescient, knowing that the referee would judge the situation the way he did with such certainty that he thought this was worthwhile, rather than trying to get quick ball and a probable try.

 

[L'irlandais]

30 years ago there were simply not the same type of collisions. Double tackling players to spear them into the ground is not rugby. If in the grassroots of the game, teams went out systemically inflicting career ending injuries on their opposition, it would end in court. The way the Elite game is heading it won't be long before that happens.

DocY as The Fat pointed out there are no prizes for guessing a YC was coming if the tackler didn't/couldn't roll away. Where in post #14 do yourself and Phil_E see legs entwined around the ball carrier? Genuinely confused by this insistance that his tackle is anything other than a try saving tackle. Sorry.

 

[dave_clark]

Lost cause breako, the majority on this forum are from RFU, they will defend WB tooth and nail. If it was so clear and obvious there would hardly be so much debate about the incident.

sorry, are you suggesting that the english are so one-eyed that english referees will blindly defend an english referee in a game that england were not playing in?

i call bullshit on that.

for what it's worth - i have not seen the game.

 

[L'irlandais]

Call it what you like. English rave about WB in the premiership. I rarely watch the premiership and so only see his performances in European rugby or International matches like yesterday's. Which leaves me wondering why people say he is such a good referee.

Wales are deserving or their win with some cracking tries and stout defense. The ref from my money is less deserving of the praise heaped on him for "such a good performance" penalising a player for offside at the non-ruck what's it was simply wrong and suggests he hasn't even seen the Italian game (which cannot be the case)

 

[Treadmore]

30 years ago there were simply not the same type of collisions.

ok

Double tackling players to spear them into the ground is not rugby.

Yes, sounds like a red card to me.

If in the grassroots of the game, teams went out systemically inflicting career ending injuries on their opposition, it would end in court.

(did you mean "intentionally" rather than "systemically"?) If this is what you meant by "targeting", nothing like that was happening in the game.

DocY as The Fat pointed out there are no prizes for guessing a YC was coming if the tackler didn't/couldn't roll away. Where in post #14 do yourself and Phil_E see legs entwined around the ball carrier? Genuinely confused by this insistance that his tackle is anything other than a try saving tackle. Sorry.

So why are you confused?:chin:

His tackle was a try-saving tackle but after the tackle WB was certain he killed the ball illegally.

Call it what you like. English rave about WB in the premiership.

who's raving...?

Wales are deserving or their win with some cracking tries and stout defense. The ref from my money is less deserving of the praise heaped on him for "such a good performance" penalising a player for offside at the non-ruck what's it was simply wrong and suggests he hasn't even seen the Italian game (which cannot be the case)

This "non-ruck"?

 

[L'irlandais]

‪Compare the infringement to 14minutes 30 seconds on the game clock. Simon Zebo is tackled by both Red14 and Red 8 inside the Welsh 5m line (Red zone), neither player release the ball carrier. Zero attempt to roll away. Yet no whistle. Apparently nothing untoward in that to WB's eyes. He does play an advantage to Ireland from this ruck just not for "came late." No advantage came of it.‬

‪Why no card in that situation when Ireland wanted quick ball. How inconsistant is that from WB. stuff playing advantage for "came late". What Law number is that? How about a yellow card and straight penalty.

 

[Treadmore]

^I'm guessing "came late" refers to Red 8's jackling actions i.e. he's engaged as he's getting to his feet after the tackle, so it's a ruck but he tries to jackle, so hands in ruck, you're too late for jackling.

I'd also guess he thought that although North didn't roll away he wasn't preventing the ball coming out, though I can't see if that is true from the TV angles.

Maybe inconsistent of Barnes but maybe he just did see that one differently.

 

[Pegleg]

Aye, and wasn't it skilful of the Welsh BC to wrap Sextons legs around himself and get him to fall on the wrong side. Then to completely immobilise him so he wasn't capable of even the slightest movement.

Very skilful and also prescient, knowing that the referee would judge the situation the way he did with such certainty that he thought this was worthwhile, rather than trying to get quick ball and a probable try.

Indeed a PK was far more useful that a try. The mantra we are given is clear and in line with Phill's comment earlier: Don't get yourself in the way. It's funny how players never get themselves caught and unable to move on the "right side".

 

[Ian_Cook]

...It's funny how players never get themselves caught and unable to move on the "right side".

 

[Ian_Cook]

"came late". What Law number is that?

Its Law 16.4 (b)

[LAWS]Players must not handle the ball in a ruck except after a tackle if they are on their feet and have their hands on the ball before the ruck is formed.[/LAWS]

If the ruck is formed then you are too late to jackle

Also referred to by some referees down south as "beaten by the cleanout"

 

[SimonSmith]

Christy I agree the referee is only applying the Laws of the game, However ‪for me it was a harsh decision. Make up your own mind ; Short ‬Highlights: Wales 22-9 Ireland. ‪May be better replays in this playlist, unfortunately not available to me this side of the channel.‬

Another "topic" beginning discussed online is his penalty of Green7 for offside at the ruck, when it was a tackle only situation. Sorry I don't have a video clip, due to (stupid) rights restrictions.

Im not an RFU referee, and I'm Scottish.

YC was nailed on, and you're wrong on the ruck, as the other thread shows.

Frankly this reads less like an inquiry and more like whining.