[Law] Marler grope

[Marc Wakeham]

Just to be a devil: if the player was grabbed by a gay player would your position change? Or a gay player was grabbed?

How would you know the player was gay?

 

[CrouchTPEngage]

I haven't heard it yet but I am wondering if a JM's defence brief could argue that the intent of the law/sanctions was about violent conduct.
"A player must not do anything that is against the spirit of good sportsmanship including including but not limited to grabbing, twisting or squeezing the genitals" is the text I saw.
He could argue the "it was just a bit of fun between mates" line. Some people have remarked that what he did was more of a "tickling and prodding" than anything intended to cause injury or pain. "Grabbing", "Twisting" and "Squeezing" are indicative of intent to hurt.
I just wonder if he'll get any mileage in that.

 

[didds]

Its about his only mileage.

Hed probably be better off sayiong sorry and bringing a plate of biscuits.

didds

 

[crossref]

I haven't heard it yet but I am wondering if a JM's defence brief could argue that the intent of the law/sanctions was about violent conduct.
"A player must not do anything that is against the spirit of good sportsmanship including including but not limited to grabbing, twisting or squeezing the genitals" is the text I saw.
He could argue the "it was just a bit of fun between mates" line. Some people have remarked that what he did was more of a "tickling and prodding" than anything intended to cause injury or pain. "Grabbing", "Twisting" and "Squeezing" are indicative of intent to hurt.
I just wonder if he'll get any mileage in that.

AWJ has already torpedoed that defence , saying he wasn't happy about it

 

[didds]

AWJ has already torpedoed that defence , saying he wasn't happy about it

mandy rice-davies moment !

 

[CrouchTPEngage]

Remember the Exeter try celebration of 2 seasons ago ? It was referred to as the 'cock tap'. As it was with players of the same team, I can only assume this was acceptable. Is that the critical difference ?

 

[crossref]

Remember the Exeter try celebration of 2 seasons ago ? It was referred to as the 'cock tap'. As it was with players of the same team, I can only assume this was acceptable. Is that the critical difference ?

Of course it's not acceptable...

In that environment was it possible for an individual player to easily opt out of the cock tapping ? or was there social pressure to conform? what do you guess?

 

[Rich_NL]

I don't think it's my job as referee to police the consensuality of team dynamics, and I believe I'd rapidly lose any authority or respect if I tried to.

I don't know the celebration, but provided its no more exuberant than others, and not shocking to observers, they can do what they like.

 

[crossref]

I don't think it's my job as referee to police the consensuality of team dynamics, and I believe I'd rapidly lose any authority or respect if I tried to.

I don't know the celebration, but provided its no more exuberant than others, and not shocking to observers, they can do what they like.

As a referee, on the field, in the game, I agree you can't get involved

 

[crossref]

What is it like when it happens to you
Chris Ashton

.I've had a finger poked up my bum. I don't want to name the player but I feel I should because it bothered me at the time.

"He poked me in the bum twice hard. I was thinking 'what's going through his mind there?' It was hard, violent and I reacted quite badly. It's happened to me a few times. I got it once in rugby league."

"sexual assault" would be an appropriate term for that right.



https://www.walesonline.co.uk/sport/rugby/rugby-news/i-would-reacted-lot-less-17896758

 

[timmad]

I think you might be missing the point a bit
Do that and you have tolerated it

Not tolerated it, made my view clear and penalised the player.

 

[timmad]

Just to be a devil: if the player was grabbed by a gay player would your position change? Or a gay player was grabbed?

I can't believe that you think that something with an entry point of 12 weeks is worthy of just a chat. 12 weeks puts it on a par with biting; is biting just a chat? It's the same as deliberate contact with the eyes?


Given where WR have the seriousness pegged, don't you think you may be a little off in your calibration?

Players' sexuality is none of my - or I believe any referee's - concern.
As to the entry level stuff, I think it's more concerned with violent conduct not the misplaced joke / wind up that Marler attempted.​

 

[crossref]

Not tolerated it, made my view clear and penalised the player.

Your post said a chat -- and then a PK. I thought you meant a PK if it happened a second time (rather unlikely)

So yes a PK is a PK. But I would say a RC is better

 

[crossref]

Players' sexuality is none of my - or I believe any referee's - concern.
As to the entry level stuff, I think it's more concerned with violent conduct not the misplaced joke / wind up that Marler attempted.​

"misplaced joke" is the wrong way to categorise this I think. That's the 'banter' defence, which is never clever.

I have now seen on twitter two videos of Marler doing the same thing before (once at a ruck, once in the changing room). It's not a one off, it's a pattern

 

[Zebra1922]

Players' sexuality is none of my - or I believe any referee's - concern.
As to the entry level stuff, I think it's more concerned with violent conduct not the misplaced joke / wind up that Marler attempted.​

This is not a misplaced joke - or if it is it is one that require admonishment and a severe sanction. It is not a joke to upstart someone, it is not a joke to touch a players breasts, it is not a joke to touch a players genetalia.

It's not banter, it's not a result of 'snowflakes' taking over the earth. It's unacceptable conduct and needs to be stamped out whenever it is seen.

 

[didds]

should the defendant's previous be considered/known by the jury?

didds

 

[crossref]

This isn't a trial , it's a disciplinary, there is no jury

 

[Not Kurt Weaver]

Just to be a devil: if the player was grabbed by a gay player would your position change? Or a gay player was grabbed?

Or what if a gay player grabbed another gay player?

Or what if a gay player grabbed his gay teammate?

Or what if a gay player grabbed his partner?,teammate or opponent?b

 

[Not Kurt Weaver]

How would you know the player was gay?

They tell you after the whistle, but before the secondary signal?

Real question, what is secondary signal?


I told Ian Iwas done posting a mere 3 hrs ago.

 

[Not Kurt Weaver]

I tried and tried to heAr GT on the video. I couldn’t even understand what he said. I mean actually hear clearly what he said.
When I saw it in print, It had lost its impact.